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JCGSU Offline
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Post: #61
RE: SBC Recruiting Roundup
(01-19-2017 10:58 AM)Saint3333 Wrote:  Elliot in a short time has done an excellent job on his first class.

I expect he will be a much better recruiter than his predecessor. My gut tells me this is the end of GSU's losing seasons.
01-19-2017 12:36 PM
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chiefsfan Offline
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RE: SBC Recruiting Roundup
I don't trust recruiting rankings at all outside of 5 star players. After that, recruiting services pretty much stand a stronger chance of whiffing on a kid than coaches do.
01-19-2017 12:54 PM
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panama Offline
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RE: SBC Recruiting Roundup
(01-19-2017 12:36 PM)JCGSU Wrote:  
(01-19-2017 10:58 AM)Saint3333 Wrote:  Elliot in a short time has done an excellent job on his first class.

I expect he will be a much better recruiter than his predecessor. My gut tells me this is the end of GSU's losing seasons.
Some of the local county newspaper reports have been really different from past seasons thats for sure.

Quote:RECRUITING NOTES: Dacula’s Jones and Harris verbally commit
By Paul Thomas

paul.thomas@gwinnettdailypost.com

Jan 18, 2017 Updated 11 hrs ago (0)
RECRUITING NOTES: Dacula’s Jones and Harris verbally commit
Dacula running back Ty Harris (25) runs away from Lanier’s Erick Turner (9) and C.J. Burress (1) during this season’s game in Dacula. (Photo: Karl L. Moore)
RECRUITING NOTES: Dacula’s Jones and Harris verbally commit
Dacula’s Jaylon Jones (21) cuts upfield as Parkview’s Cameron Khalil (3) reaches in from behind at Parkview in Lilburn. (Photo: Karl L. Moore)
RECRUITING NOTES: Dacula’s Jones and Harris verbally commit
Peachtree Ridge's Zane Ashley (7) makaes a catch over North Gwinnett's Cameron Cobb (88) and scores a touchdown in Friday's game. (Photo: Craig Cappy)
RECRUITING NOTES: Dacula’s Jones and Harris verbally commit
Grayson receiver Elijah Shah (14) gets aways from Woodstock's Landon Dixon (17) during Friday night's state playoff game at Grayson in Loganville. (Photo: Karl L. Moore)
RECRUITING NOTES: Dacula’s Jones and Harris verbally commit
Buford's Garrett Scoggins (55) and Innis Claud (78) fire off the ball during second quarter action of the Wolves' second round game with Worth County on Friday night in Buford. (Photo: David McGregor)
RECRUITING NOTES: Dacula’s Jones and Harris verbally commit
Zack Waters (36) makes a stop against Roswell's Jujuan White (14) during the Corky Kell Classic at McEachern High School Friday at McEachern High School in Powder Springs. (Photo: Will Fagan)
A pair of Dacula recruits verbally committed this week.

During his official visit to Georgia State over the weekend Jaylon Jones pledged to Georgia State over offers from Arkansas State, Army, Navy and Ball State.

On Wednesday two-way star Ty Harris committed to Army. He said he seriously considered Gardner-Webb as well.

“Me and my parents sat down at the table after we had just got back from the visit we took (over the weekend),” Harris said. “After weighing the options and all the benefits that could come with attending Army and we just came to the conclusion that it would be the best decision not for the next four years, but also for years to come after college because it provides so many connections and career opportunities for me.”

The 6-foot-1, 220-pound Harris played linebacker and running back for the Region 8-AAAAAA champion Falcons. On defense he recorded 70 tackles and three sacks. On offense he rushed for 1,001 yards and eight touchdowns and caught 11 passes for 99 yards and a TD. He will be a B-back for the Black Knights.

“Their offense is sort of like Dacula’s offense so it’s right at home for me,” he said.

Jones recorded 90 tackles as a safety for Dacula this season. He said Georgia State plans to use him in a similar role. The Panthers originally offered him during his junior season, but he had not considered them much until Shawn Elliot was hired in December.

Once former Buford head coach Jess Simpson joined the staff, he called Dacula head coach Tommy Jones (no relation) to tell him they were interested in Jaylon Jones. He visited Atlanta this weekend and pulled the trigger.

“I loved the atmosphere of the city and everything they’re trying to do with the new stadium, taking over Turner Field,” Jaylon Jones said of why he picked Georgia State. “The new locker room, I feel like it’s really going to be a change because Georgia State in the past hasn’t had their own stadium to call home. I think it’ll be a good change. Also the new coaches, Coach Elliot, his vision and the transformation of the program. Coming from South Carolina, coming from a Power 5 school, so he knows what it takes to play ball at that level and win. Also definitely the academics program. There’s a lot of resources I can use in the city to be successful.”


The whole part in bold is the opposite of what we have experienced for at least 5 years.
(This post was last modified: 01-19-2017 12:56 PM by panama.)
01-19-2017 12:54 PM
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panama Offline
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RE: SBC Recruiting Roundup
(01-19-2017 12:54 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  I don't trust recruiting rankings at all outside of 5 star players. After that, recruiting services pretty much stand a stronger chance of whiffing on a kid than coaches do.

247 does pretty well
01-19-2017 12:58 PM
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Saint3333 Online
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RE: SBC Recruiting Roundup
(01-19-2017 11:44 AM)panama Wrote:  
(01-19-2017 10:58 AM)Saint3333 Wrote:  Elliot in a short time has done an excellent job on his first class.

If these guys can actually coach in games, things could get interesting.

He'll be able to motivate as well. The only real unknown about Elliot is his ability to manage late game situations (just no experience there).

GA St.'s athletic department in 2017 has more 2008-2010 App St. AD employees than App does in 2017. Football will be a priority. The east division in two years could be special.
01-19-2017 01:05 PM
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AppManDG Offline
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RE: SBC Recruiting Roundup
(01-19-2017 10:44 AM)07pantheralum Wrote:  
(01-19-2017 10:37 AM)AppManDG Wrote:  
(01-18-2017 06:24 PM)JCGSU Wrote:  
(01-18-2017 05:05 PM)AppManDG Wrote:  
(01-18-2017 01:02 PM)JCGSU Wrote:  Exceptions to the rule. So was App last year btw. App was the ONLY team in the bottom half of the G5 as far as team talent to win a CC or share one anyway. Also one of very few to have a winning record. The star thing matters a lot for most teams even at our level. Only Navy that has no scholarship limit was probably the bigger outlier that App.


http://247sports.com/Season/2016-Footbal...tComposite

http://www.foxsports.com/college-footbal...son-020116

But what annoys me to no end is the annual lazy narrative that the recruiting rankings at the center of Signing Day are meaningless. A favorite trick is to hold up someone like Houston Texans star J.J. Watt (former two-star recruit) or 2014 Heisman winner Marcus Mariota (three stars) as an indictment of the entire system. Or a school like Boise State that’s won at a high level or without a host of blue-chippers. Or Texas, which has essentially done the opposite.

But what these critics hold up as “evidence,” anyone with a basic understanding of statistics calls “outliers.”

Not an exception at all. The fact of the matter is very few players below 4 stars are sufficiently evaluated. When they are it's by some guy who has probably never snapped on a helmet on past Pop Warner sitting behind a computer screen watching tape. There are a ton of kids who can't make it to camps and never get the opportunity to show their skills. I put far more trust in an actual coach's decision to offer a young man based on what he has seen firsthand. App's staff has been masterful at finding diamonds in the rough at camps. You might could make a case App's coaches just work everyone else, but I don't think so. You could put a majority of 3 and 2 star rated players in a paper bag and dump them out without the stars attached and you couldn't tell a bit of difference. Of the 18 rated players (some played college before the star system was introduced) starting for last year's Super Bowl Champion Broncos, 8 were two star rated.

That is not true at all because most P5 rosters are majority three star kids and three star ratings especially high grade three stars are hard to get. That is what folks like to regurgitate but it is not true. You know little about the three star rating as a three star can be a top recruit with elite P5 offers or barely a three star and just recieving FCS. So yes a person that has never played football can tell a difference between a .894 and a .795 rated kid much less one that is only a two star kid because there is usually a huge difference on size, speed and or what they accomplished in high school. The fact you think the three star rating was a one size fits all tells me all I really need to know. Also the fact you think the guys rating these kids have no idea what they are looking at is also not true most have been doing it for years and are supervised by some guys that have been doing it for decades and many are former players and coaches.

Yep no difference between these top 3's and a two star kid

http://247sports.com/Player/Adarius-Lemons-85884

http://247sports.com/Player/Chuba-Hubbard-89471

for reference here is a kid that barely made the three star cut...Ray Charles can see the difference in the type of schools that are recruiting each and he is blind and dead.

http://247sports.com/Player/Billy-Reagins-92224

You should really let all those P5's like AL to quit wasting time on offering high rated three star kids. Also lets not get it twisted App has done well by Sun Belt standards but nobody is confusing you with Houston or Boise just yet. You shared the Sun Belt CC without playing a title game or playing the team you shared it with as well. My only point is you are the only team to have claim to a conference title being in the bottom half of the ratings one team out of 30 +/- proves my point not the other way around.

Also if you want to talk NFL it backs the rating system not disproves it at all. If you know anything about stats you know population sizes matter when talking about what rating NFL players were.

OK Einstein. So, population now helps to determine a player's rating? That's one I've not heard in my 35+ years of following recruiting. Guess that's why DeShaun Watson garnered 4 star status coming out of that major metropolitan area Gainesville.GA, population 35,000. Stats and math do NOT determine a players ability. A lot of really good players play on really bad teams. A WR can't catch balls if he doesn't have a QB who can throw it to him. A RB can't make a ton of yards unless he has a line. You're just like so many other guys who fancy them self as a self proclaimed recruiting guru. Mostly a bunch of facts and figures that amount to nothing.

LOL...Einstein...

I'm sure that poster will be here shortly to disembowel you, but he clearly meant that the high population of 2-stars (they are BY FAR the biggest group in the star levels) will ensure that a number of them end up on NFL teams and Super Bowl squads. It's numbers.
Now you've gone and ruined it. I love to poke and prod these guys. Use the absurd to illustrate the absurd. Its so easy to get under their skin..

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01-19-2017 01:14 PM
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chiefsfan Offline
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Post: #67
RE: SBC Recruiting Roundup
(01-19-2017 12:58 PM)panama Wrote:  
(01-19-2017 12:54 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  I don't trust recruiting rankings at all outside of 5 star players. After that, recruiting services pretty much stand a stronger chance of whiffing on a kid than coaches do.

247 does pretty well

They do well for the teams that use their service. I've never been impressed with their work for AState though. Takes them too long to rate players, and several days to get our commitment list updated.

It's the major flaw of a recruiting service. They are not going to spend a lot of time on a school unless they have a writer assigned to them. Especially G5 schools.
01-19-2017 01:17 PM
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panama Offline
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SBC Recruiting Roundup
(01-19-2017 01:05 PM)Saint3333 Wrote:  
(01-19-2017 11:44 AM)panama Wrote:  
(01-19-2017 10:58 AM)Saint3333 Wrote:  Elliot in a short time has done an excellent job on his first class.

If these guys can actually coach in games, things could get interesting.

He'll be able to motivate as well. The only real unknown about Elliot is his ability to manage late game situations (just no experience there).

GA St.'s athletic department in 2017 has more 2008-2010 App St. AD employees than App does in 2017. Football will be a priority. The east division in two years could be special.


Still think we need more Atlanta folks in Marketing and Development.


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01-19-2017 01:18 PM
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AppManDG Offline
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RE: SBC Recruiting Roundup
(01-19-2017 11:33 AM)AtlantaJag Wrote:  
(01-18-2017 05:45 PM)LatahCounty Wrote:  Recruiting rankings and winning -- correlation or causation?

Take a high school kid and tell the scouting services he's deciding between Alabama, Georgia & Florida State. Automatic 4 stars at least. Take that exact same kid and tell them he's deciding between Idaho, Montana and New Mexico State. 2 stars, maybe 3 if he really, really stands out. And hey, that first group of schools wins a lot more than the 2nd group, so the ranking services must be great.

I've seen tons of guys get downgraded as soon as they sign with Idaho. And the services are right to be suddenly suspicious -- if the guy is so great, why isn't he going to a better program? But that doesn't mean they're actually "evaluating talent." They're just playing the odds.

Are you sure you're seeing player rankings get downgraded? Two and three star players don't get reevaluated very often unless they suddenly get a top-rated offer and then they're moving up. Perhaps what you saw was other recruiting service ratings being added into a composite score and changing how your player was scored.Usually when someone commits anywhere, the staff at 247 will go look for other service rankings and add them into the player's composite.
App has a safety commit that was a borderline 4 star recruit as a Jr because he was generating interest from UGA and some other SEC schools. The day after committing to App he was downgraded to barely a 3 star (81). That's a perfect example of the experts evaluating high school talent.

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01-19-2017 01:23 PM
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RE: SBC Recruiting Roundup
(01-19-2017 01:23 PM)AppManDG Wrote:  
(01-19-2017 11:33 AM)AtlantaJag Wrote:  
(01-18-2017 05:45 PM)LatahCounty Wrote:  Recruiting rankings and winning -- correlation or causation?

Take a high school kid and tell the scouting services he's deciding between Alabama, Georgia & Florida State. Automatic 4 stars at least. Take that exact same kid and tell them he's deciding between Idaho, Montana and New Mexico State. 2 stars, maybe 3 if he really, really stands out. And hey, that first group of schools wins a lot more than the 2nd group, so the ranking services must be great.

I've seen tons of guys get downgraded as soon as they sign with Idaho. And the services are right to be suddenly suspicious -- if the guy is so great, why isn't he going to a better program? But that doesn't mean they're actually "evaluating talent." They're just playing the odds.

Are you sure you're seeing player rankings get downgraded? Two and three star players don't get reevaluated very often unless they suddenly get a top-rated offer and then they're moving up. Perhaps what you saw was other recruiting service ratings being added into a composite score and changing how your player was scored.Usually when someone commits anywhere, the staff at 247 will go look for other service rankings and add them into the player's composite.
App has a safety commit that was a borderline 4 star recruit as a Jr because he was generating interest from UGA and some other SEC schools. The day after committing to App he was downgraded to barely a 3 star (81). That's a perfect example of the experts evaluating high school talent.

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That's extremely common in recruiting rankings. A recruiting service partially bases their evaluation of a kid on his offer list. If there are offers from stronger SEC programs, they get a higher rating. If that recruit than commits to a G5 programs, it's almost as if the service assumes that the SEC school must have pulled their offer, so they get downgraded.

It helps if you have a dedicated person working for a service who can fight for that players rating, but if you don't, you'll spend a lot of time watching all your commitments get downgraded.
01-19-2017 01:27 PM
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AppManDG Offline
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RE: SBC Recruiting Roundup
(01-19-2017 11:44 AM)panama Wrote:  
(01-19-2017 10:58 AM)Saint3333 Wrote:  Elliot in a short time has done an excellent job on his first class.

If these guys can actually coach in games, things could get interesting.
Known Elliot ever since he showed up in Boone. Very good OL but I've never been sold on his HC abilities. Guess we'll soon find out.

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01-19-2017 01:29 PM
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RE: SBC Recruiting Roundup
(01-19-2017 01:27 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(01-19-2017 01:23 PM)AppManDG Wrote:  
(01-19-2017 11:33 AM)AtlantaJag Wrote:  
(01-18-2017 05:45 PM)LatahCounty Wrote:  Recruiting rankings and winning -- correlation or causation?

Take a high school kid and tell the scouting services he's deciding between Alabama, Georgia & Florida State. Automatic 4 stars at least. Take that exact same kid and tell them he's deciding between Idaho, Montana and New Mexico State. 2 stars, maybe 3 if he really, really stands out. And hey, that first group of schools wins a lot more than the 2nd group, so the ranking services must be great.

I've seen tons of guys get downgraded as soon as they sign with Idaho. And the services are right to be suddenly suspicious -- if the guy is so great, why isn't he going to a better program? But that doesn't mean they're actually "evaluating talent." They're just playing the odds.

Are you sure you're seeing player rankings get downgraded? Two and three star players don't get reevaluated very often unless they suddenly get a top-rated offer and then they're moving up. Perhaps what you saw was other recruiting service ratings being added into a composite score and changing how your player was scored.Usually when someone commits anywhere, the staff at 247 will go look for other service rankings and add them into the player's composite.
App has a safety commit that was a borderline 4 star recruit as a Jr because he was generating interest from UGA and some other SEC schools. The day after committing to App he was downgraded to barely a 3 star (81). That's a perfect example of the experts evaluating high school talent.

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That's extremely common in recruiting rankings. A recruiting service partially bases their evaluation of a kid on his offer list. If there are offers from stronger SEC programs, they get a higher rating. If that recruit than commits to a G5 programs, it's almost as if the service assumes that the SEC school must have pulled their offer, so they get downgraded.

It helps if you have a dedicated person working for a service who can fight for that players rating, but if you don't, you'll spend a lot of time watching all your commitments get downgraded.
Exactly why I put so little credibility in these guys.

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01-19-2017 01:31 PM
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chiefsfan Offline
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Post: #73
RE: SBC Recruiting Roundup
(01-19-2017 01:31 PM)AppManDG Wrote:  
(01-19-2017 01:27 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(01-19-2017 01:23 PM)AppManDG Wrote:  
(01-19-2017 11:33 AM)AtlantaJag Wrote:  
(01-18-2017 05:45 PM)LatahCounty Wrote:  Recruiting rankings and winning -- correlation or causation?

Take a high school kid and tell the scouting services he's deciding between Alabama, Georgia & Florida State. Automatic 4 stars at least. Take that exact same kid and tell them he's deciding between Idaho, Montana and New Mexico State. 2 stars, maybe 3 if he really, really stands out. And hey, that first group of schools wins a lot more than the 2nd group, so the ranking services must be great.

I've seen tons of guys get downgraded as soon as they sign with Idaho. And the services are right to be suddenly suspicious -- if the guy is so great, why isn't he going to a better program? But that doesn't mean they're actually "evaluating talent." They're just playing the odds.

Are you sure you're seeing player rankings get downgraded? Two and three star players don't get reevaluated very often unless they suddenly get a top-rated offer and then they're moving up. Perhaps what you saw was other recruiting service ratings being added into a composite score and changing how your player was scored.Usually when someone commits anywhere, the staff at 247 will go look for other service rankings and add them into the player's composite.
App has a safety commit that was a borderline 4 star recruit as a Jr because he was generating interest from UGA and some other SEC schools. The day after committing to App he was downgraded to barely a 3 star (81). That's a perfect example of the experts evaluating high school talent.

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That's extremely common in recruiting rankings. A recruiting service partially bases their evaluation of a kid on his offer list. If there are offers from stronger SEC programs, they get a higher rating. If that recruit than commits to a G5 programs, it's almost as if the service assumes that the SEC school must have pulled their offer, so they get downgraded.

It helps if you have a dedicated person working for a service who can fight for that players rating, but if you don't, you'll spend a lot of time watching all your commitments get downgraded.
Exactly why I put so little credibility in these guys.

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I've joked about this for a while, but Arkansas State went the first 19 years of their time in FBS without a designated writer covering us for one of the major recruiting services. During that time, we never once finished ranked tops in the Sun Belt.

The first time we got our own website on scout and our own writer who covered us extensively, we had the top class in the conference on that website.

South Alabama and Georgia State are going to love 247 because they have guys who work for those sites who can keep their commitments up to date, and fight to get more players with a 3 star rating. Those of us without the service, don't see the same benefit. That's how those guys operate. They want you to sign up with them so you can get the same access and they make more money.
01-19-2017 01:38 PM
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TroyFootball05 Offline
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RE: SBC Recruiting Roundup
(01-19-2017 01:27 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  That's extremely common in recruiting rankings. A recruiting service partially bases their evaluation of a kid on his offer list. If there are offers from stronger SEC programs, they get a higher rating. If that recruit than commits to a G5 programs, it's almost as if the service assumes that the SEC school must have pulled their offer, so they get downgraded.

It helps if you have a dedicated person working for a service who can fight for that players rating, but if you don't, you'll spend a lot of time watching all your commitments get downgraded.

I've seen a few of you post similar statements and I often wonder how much of that is hyperbole based on a myth. Maybe you've seen it happen once or twice and want to exaggerate it's frequency (human nature) or make a cause/effect analysis that isn't really correct (misunderstanding the composite when another service's rating is added, as one example).

I've followed Troy recruiting for nearly a decade, and I've never once seen it happen to a Troy commit. My experience is completely anecdotal. There are enough people saying they've seen it happen for me to give it some thought. I'm willing to believe, but I'm gonna need some proof, not just "I seen it".
(This post was last modified: 01-19-2017 02:51 PM by TroyFootball05.)
01-19-2017 02:07 PM
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LatahCounty Offline
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RE: SBC Recruiting Roundup
(01-19-2017 02:07 PM)TroyFootball05 Wrote:  
(01-19-2017 01:27 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  That's extremely common in recruiting rankings. A recruiting service partially bases their evaluation of a kid on his offer list. If there are offers from stronger SEC programs, they get a higher rating. If that recruit than commits to a G5 programs, it's almost as if the service assumes that the SEC school must have pulled their offer, so they get downgraded.

It helps if you have a dedicated person working for a service who can fight for that players rating, but if you don't, you'll spend a lot of time watching all your commitments get downgraded.

I've seen a few of you post similar statements and I often wonder how much of that is hyperbole based on a myth. Maybe you've seen it happen once or twice and want to exaggerate it's frequency (human nature) or make a cause/effect analysis that isn't really correct (misunderstanding the composite when a another service's ranting is added, as one example).

I've followed Troy recruiting for nearly a decade, and I've never once seen it happen to a Troy commit. My experience is completely anecdotal. There are enough people saying they've seen it happen for me to give it some thought. I'm willing to believe, but I'm gonna need some proof, not just "I seen it".

Unfortunately I never tried to make a before/after spreadsheet on Idaho recruits so I have nothing to show anyone other than my own recollection. I'll try to pay attention this year but I have a feeling it might happen less to a 9-4 Idaho team with a returning conference COY than it did when our program was a mess.
01-19-2017 02:16 PM
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RE: SBC Recruiting Roundup
(01-19-2017 02:07 PM)TroyFootball05 Wrote:  
(01-19-2017 01:27 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  That's extremely common in recruiting rankings. A recruiting service partially bases their evaluation of a kid on his offer list. If there are offers from stronger SEC programs, they get a higher rating. If that recruit than commits to a G5 programs, it's almost as if the service assumes that the SEC school must have pulled their offer, so they get downgraded.

It helps if you have a dedicated person working for a service who can fight for that players rating, but if you don't, you'll spend a lot of time watching all your commitments get downgraded.

I've seen a few of you post similar statements and I often wonder how much of that is hyperbole based on a myth. Maybe you've seen it happen once or twice and want to exaggerate it's frequency (human nature) or make a cause/effect analysis that isn't really correct (misunderstanding the composite when a another service's ranting is added, as one example).

I've followed Troy recruiting for nearly a decade, and I've never once seen it happen to a Troy commit. My experience is completely anecdotal. There are enough people saying they've seen it happen for me to give it some thought. I'm willing to believe, but I'm gonna need some proof, not just "I seen it".

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01-19-2017 02:21 PM
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RE: SBC Recruiting Roundup
(01-19-2017 01:38 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(01-19-2017 01:31 PM)AppManDG Wrote:  
(01-19-2017 01:27 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(01-19-2017 01:23 PM)AppManDG Wrote:  
(01-19-2017 11:33 AM)AtlantaJag Wrote:  Are you sure you're seeing player rankings get downgraded? Two and three star players don't get reevaluated very often unless they suddenly get a top-rated offer and then they're moving up. Perhaps what you saw was other recruiting service ratings being added into a composite score and changing how your player was scored.Usually when someone commits anywhere, the staff at 247 will go look for other service rankings and add them into the player's composite.
App has a safety commit that was a borderline 4 star recruit as a Jr because he was generating interest from UGA and some other SEC schools. The day after committing to App he was downgraded to barely a 3 star (81). That's a perfect example of the experts evaluating high school talent.

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That's extremely common in recruiting rankings. A recruiting service partially bases their evaluation of a kid on his offer list. If there are offers from stronger SEC programs, they get a higher rating. If that recruit than commits to a G5 programs, it's almost as if the service assumes that the SEC school must have pulled their offer, so they get downgraded.

It helps if you have a dedicated person working for a service who can fight for that players rating, but if you don't, you'll spend a lot of time watching all your commitments get downgraded.
Exactly why I put so little credibility in these guys.

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I've joked about this for a while, but Arkansas State went the first 19 years of their time in FBS without a designated writer covering us for one of the major recruiting services. During that time, we never once finished ranked tops in the Sun Belt.

The first time we got our own website on scout and our own writer who covered us extensively, we had the top class in the conference on that website.

South Alabama and Georgia State are going to love 247 because they have guys who work for those sites who can keep their commitments up to date, and fight to get more players with a 3 star rating. Those of us without the service, don't see the same benefit. That's how those guys operate. They want you to sign up with them so you can get the same access and they make more money.

I can absolutely assure you that the publishers of the 247 sites have no influence with the ratings. All you can do is update the list, request a ranking if the player is unrated and start saying your Our Fathers....
(This post was last modified: 01-19-2017 03:20 PM by AtlantaJag.)
01-19-2017 02:23 PM
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AtlantaJag Offline
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Post: #78
RE: SBC Recruiting Roundup
(01-19-2017 02:16 PM)LatahCounty Wrote:  
(01-19-2017 02:07 PM)TroyFootball05 Wrote:  
(01-19-2017 01:27 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  That's extremely common in recruiting rankings. A recruiting service partially bases their evaluation of a kid on his offer list. If there are offers from stronger SEC programs, they get a higher rating. If that recruit than commits to a G5 programs, it's almost as if the service assumes that the SEC school must have pulled their offer, so they get downgraded.

It helps if you have a dedicated person working for a service who can fight for that players rating, but if you don't, you'll spend a lot of time watching all your commitments get downgraded.

I've seen a few of you post similar statements and I often wonder how much of that is hyperbole based on a myth. Maybe you've seen it happen once or twice and want to exaggerate it's frequency (human nature) or make a cause/effect analysis that isn't really correct (misunderstanding the composite when a another service's ranting is added, as one example).

I've followed Troy recruiting for nearly a decade, and I've never once seen it happen to a Troy commit. My experience is completely anecdotal. There are enough people saying they've seen it happen for me to give it some thought. I'm willing to believe, but I'm gonna need some proof, not just "I seen it".

Unfortunately I never tried to make a before/after spreadsheet on Idaho recruits so I have nothing to show anyone other than my own recollection. I'll try to pay attention this year but I have a feeling it might happen less to a 9-4 Idaho team with a returning conference COY than it did when our program was a mess.

As you observe the rankings, keep in mind on 247 that there is a composite score and 247 ranking. I'd recommend keeping an eye on just the 247 to see if it changes because the composite does regularly when other services give their rankings and they are added.
01-19-2017 02:26 PM
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ericsaid Offline
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Post: #79
RE: SBC Recruiting Roundup
(01-19-2017 01:38 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(01-19-2017 01:31 PM)AppManDG Wrote:  
(01-19-2017 01:27 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(01-19-2017 01:23 PM)AppManDG Wrote:  
(01-19-2017 11:33 AM)AtlantaJag Wrote:  Are you sure you're seeing player rankings get downgraded? Two and three star players don't get reevaluated very often unless they suddenly get a top-rated offer and then they're moving up. Perhaps what you saw was other recruiting service ratings being added into a composite score and changing how your player was scored.Usually when someone commits anywhere, the staff at 247 will go look for other service rankings and add them into the player's composite.
App has a safety commit that was a borderline 4 star recruit as a Jr because he was generating interest from UGA and some other SEC schools. The day after committing to App he was downgraded to barely a 3 star (81). That's a perfect example of the experts evaluating high school talent.

Sent from my XT1254 using CSNbbs mobile app

That's extremely common in recruiting rankings. A recruiting service partially bases their evaluation of a kid on his offer list. If there are offers from stronger SEC programs, they get a higher rating. If that recruit than commits to a G5 programs, it's almost as if the service assumes that the SEC school must have pulled their offer, so they get downgraded.

It helps if you have a dedicated person working for a service who can fight for that players rating, but if you don't, you'll spend a lot of time watching all your commitments get downgraded.
Exactly why I put so little credibility in these guys.

Sent from my XT1254 using CSNbbs mobile app

I've joked about this for a while, but Arkansas State went the first 19 years of their time in FBS without a designated writer covering us for one of the major recruiting services. During that time, we never once finished ranked tops in the Sun Belt.

The first time we got our own website on scout and our own writer who covered us extensively, we had the top class in the conference on that website.

South Alabama and Georgia State are going to love 247 because they have guys who work for those sites who can keep their commitments up to date, and fight to get more players with a 3 star rating. Those of us without the service, don't see the same benefit. That's how those guys operate. They want you to sign up with them so you can get the same access and they make more money.

What's wrong with having a tactic to increase revenue?
01-19-2017 02:53 PM
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ericsaid Offline
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RE: SBC Recruiting Roundup
(01-19-2017 01:05 PM)Saint3333 Wrote:  
(01-19-2017 11:44 AM)panama Wrote:  
(01-19-2017 10:58 AM)Saint3333 Wrote:  Elliot in a short time has done an excellent job on his first class.

If these guys can actually coach in games, things could get interesting.

He'll be able to motivate as well. The only real unknown about Elliot is his ability to manage late game situations (just no experience there).

GA St.'s athletic department in 2017 has more 2008-2010 App St. AD employees than App does in 2017. Football will be a priority. The east division in two years could be special.

The real question is will people show up to games? Without an atmosphere to play in, kids will still choose Southern, App or Coastal....or any of the other 75 FBS schools that recruit Georgia.
01-19-2017 02:56 PM
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