Smitherman should tell Sayler not to wander off anywhere.
Tonight on David Letterman's Top 10 list:
New Slogan for the largest City in Alabama.
#10. Hey brother, can you spare $21 million?
#9. Welcome to irmingha . The city where elected criminals take everything.
#8. "For $21 million, your name goes here" think of all those maps and signs on I-65.
#7. Welcome to "Donald Trumpville"
#6. Birmingham, just like the mafia used to run New Jersey. 21 million, fuggetaboudit.
#5. Welcome to the Jefferson County Metro Complex, not wait, they are more screwed up than we are and It's Leapin Larry's fault too.
#4. Birmingham, I bet we vote Republican next time
#3. Birmingham, one seriously #ucked up place.
#2. 最初にアラバマの日本都市へのこんにちはそして歓迎 -Good afternoon and welcome to the first Japanese city in Alabama
#1. Welcome to Birmingham, the Detroit of the South!
#2 I think Lincoln, AL holds that distinction. Germany has Vance and Mobile, South Korea has Montgomery.
#4 was interesting. Jeffco elected a bunch of Republicans to get them out of their troubles. How has that worked out?
#9 Aren't you confusing the city with the county? (see #5)
#1 We do have one thing in common that many of our troubles can be traced to: We are both our state's largest city and our state keeps hoping we will go away.
(11-03-2009 02:55 PM)BAMANBLAZERFAN Wrote: [ -> ]#2 I think Lincoln, AL holds that distinction. Germany has Vance and Mobile, South Korea has Montgomery.
And right now are likely the most prosperous cities in our state. Japan, Germany and South Korea are about the only things going for Alabama.
(11-03-2009 04:49 PM)BatesUAB Wrote: [ -> ] (11-03-2009 02:55 PM)BAMANBLAZERFAN Wrote: [ -> ]#2 I think Lincoln, AL holds that distinction. Germany has Vance and Mobile, South Korea has Montgomery.
And right now are likely the most prosperous cities in our state. Japan, Germany and South Korea are about the only things going for Alabama.
You are correct since those companies have found it to be so much cheaper to hire non-union Alabama laborers who expect little from a company than to employ workers in their own countries who expect higher pay and greater benefits. When you add in the tax evasion laws they have in their favor, they are in the best possible place for their profit margins. And if Alabama workers get "uppity", they can always threaten to move elsewhere because lots of states would love to get those jobs for their workers and would bribe them just like we did to get them. Alabama has a long history of selling its people to lowest bidders.
BTW, I will not "hold my breath" until the state industrial search agency brings anything to "Imperial Jeffco"-- they never have and probably never will. Any excuse for that fact will do.
(11-08-2009 10:02 PM)BAMANBLAZERFAN Wrote: [ -> ] (11-03-2009 04:49 PM)BatesUAB Wrote: [ -> ] (11-03-2009 02:55 PM)BAMANBLAZERFAN Wrote: [ -> ]#2 I think Lincoln, AL holds that distinction. Germany has Vance and Mobile, South Korea has Montgomery.
And right now are likely the most prosperous cities in our state. Japan, Germany and South Korea are about the only things going for Alabama.
You are correct since those companies have found it to be so much cheaper to hire non-union Alabama laborers who expect little from a company than to employ workers in their own countries who expect higher pay and greater benefits. When you add in the tax evasion laws they have in their favor, they are in the best possible place for their profit margins. And if Alabama workers get "uppity", they can always threaten to move elsewhere because lots of states would love to get those jobs for their workers and would bribe them just like we did to get them. Alabama has a long history of selling its people to lowest bidders.
BTW, I will not "hold my breath" until the state industrial search agency brings anything to "Imperial Jeffco"-- they never have and probably never will. Any excuse for that fact will do.
I know people who have worked in the AL auto plants. They have the right to unionize but don't because they come out better not having to pay dues. Some people actually like working and thinking for themselves.
BTW, you forgot about the Toyota plant in Huntsville. Another one of the most prosperous cities in AL and one of the best places to live in the US.
(11-08-2009 11:12 PM)LightEmUp70 Wrote: [ -> ] (11-08-2009 10:02 PM)BAMANBLAZERFAN Wrote: [ -> ] (11-03-2009 04:49 PM)BatesUAB Wrote: [ -> ] (11-03-2009 02:55 PM)BAMANBLAZERFAN Wrote: [ -> ]#2 I think Lincoln, AL holds that distinction. Germany has Vance and Mobile, South Korea has Montgomery.
And right now are likely the most prosperous cities in our state. Japan, Germany and South Korea are about the only things going for Alabama.
You are correct since those companies have found it to be so much cheaper to hire non-union Alabama laborers who expect little from a company than to employ workers in their own countries who expect higher pay and greater benefits. When you add in the tax evasion laws they have in their favor, they are in the best possible place for their profit margins. And if Alabama workers get "uppity", they can always threaten to move elsewhere because lots of states would love to get those jobs for their workers and would bribe them just like we did to get them. Alabama has a long history of selling its people to lowest bidders.
BTW, I will not "hold my breath" until the state industrial search agency brings anything to "Imperial Jeffco"-- they never have and probably never will. Any excuse for that fact will do.
I know people who have worked in the AL auto plants. They have the right to unionize but don't because they come out better not having to pay dues. Some people actually like working and thinking for themselves.
BTW, you forgot about the Toyota plant in Huntsville. Another one of the most prosperous cities in AL and one of the best places to live in the US.
With its engineering/technology employment base, the Toyota plant is not the big deal it is in Huntsville as it is in the other areas. Unless the space programs shut down and NASA goes out of business, Huntsville will be doing just fine regardless of auto plants (but they are a good addition anyway). I'm really happy for Huntsville because when the legislature was forced by von Braun's threats to set up UAH, they also set up UAB while they were about it.
(11-09-2009 01:57 AM)BAMANBLAZERFAN Wrote: [ -> ] (11-08-2009 11:12 PM)LightEmUp70 Wrote: [ -> ] (11-08-2009 10:02 PM)BAMANBLAZERFAN Wrote: [ -> ] (11-03-2009 04:49 PM)BatesUAB Wrote: [ -> ] (11-03-2009 02:55 PM)BAMANBLAZERFAN Wrote: [ -> ]#2 I think Lincoln, AL holds that distinction. Germany has Vance and Mobile, South Korea has Montgomery.
And right now are likely the most prosperous cities in our state. Japan, Germany and South Korea are about the only things going for Alabama.
You are correct since those companies have found it to be so much cheaper to hire non-union Alabama laborers who expect little from a company than to employ workers in their own countries who expect higher pay and greater benefits. When you add in the tax evasion laws they have in their favor, they are in the best possible place for their profit margins. And if Alabama workers get "uppity", they can always threaten to move elsewhere because lots of states would love to get those jobs for their workers and would bribe them just like we did to get them. Alabama has a long history of selling its people to lowest bidders.
BTW, I will not "hold my breath" until the state industrial search agency brings anything to "Imperial Jeffco"-- they never have and probably never will. Any excuse for that fact will do.
I know people who have worked in the AL auto plants. They have the right to unionize but don't because they come out better not having to pay dues. Some people actually like working and thinking for themselves.
BTW, you forgot about the Toyota plant in Huntsville. Another one of the most prosperous cities in AL and one of the best places to live in the US.
With its engineering/technology employment base, the Toyota plant is not the big deal it is in Huntsville as it is in the other areas. Unless the space programs shut down and NASA goes out of business, Huntsville will be doing just fine regardless of auto plants (but they are a good addition anyway). I'm really happy for Huntsville because when the legislature was forced by von Braun's threats to set up UAH, they also set up UAB while they were about it.
MDA, NASA, DOD & AMC are all just a stroke of the pen by the leader y'all elected from being empty buildings. And the 1st to go will be the contractors for each organization, with there being a 3 to 1 contractor ratio. Only 3 more years.
(11-09-2009 10:47 AM)BlazerPhil Wrote: [ -> ] (11-09-2009 01:57 AM)BAMANBLAZERFAN Wrote: [ -> ] (11-08-2009 11:12 PM)LightEmUp70 Wrote: [ -> ] (11-08-2009 10:02 PM)BAMANBLAZERFAN Wrote: [ -> ] (11-03-2009 04:49 PM)BatesUAB Wrote: [ -> ] (11-03-2009 02:55 PM)BAMANBLAZERFAN Wrote: [ -> ]#2 I think Lincoln, AL holds that distinction. Germany has Vance and Mobile, South Korea has Montgomery.
And right now are likely the most prosperous cities in our state. Japan, Germany and South Korea are about the only things going for Alabama.
You are correct since those companies have found it to be so much cheaper to hire non-union Alabama laborers who expect little from a company than to employ workers in their own countries who expect higher pay and greater benefits. When you add in the tax evasion laws they have in their favor, they are in the best possible place for their profit margins. And if Alabama workers get "uppity", they can always threaten to move elsewhere because lots of states would love to get those jobs for their workers and would bribe them just like we did to get them. Alabama has a long history of selling its people to lowest bidders.
BTW, I will not "hold my breath" until the state industrial search agency brings anything to "Imperial Jeffco"-- they never have and probably never will. Any excuse for that fact will do.
I know people who have worked in the AL auto plants. They have the right to unionize but don't because they come out better not having to pay dues. Some people actually like working and thinking for themselves.
BTW, you forgot about the Toyota plant in Huntsville. Another one of the most prosperous cities in AL and one of the best places to live in the US.
With its engineering/technology employment base, the Toyota plant is not the big deal it is in Huntsville as it is in the other areas. Unless the space programs shut down and NASA goes out of business, Huntsville will be doing just fine regardless of auto plants (but they are a good addition anyway). I'm really happy for Huntsville because when the legislature was forced by von Braun's threats to set up UAH, they also set up UAB while they were about it.
MDA, NASA, DOD & AMC are all just a stroke of the pen by the leader y'all elected from being empty buildings. And the 1st to go will be the contractors for each organization, with there being a 3 to 1 contractor ratio. Only 3 more years.
That "stroke of the pen" can ONLY happen if the Congress writes it into a bill it passes and sends to the President to sign. What would have to transpire in order for that eventuality to come about? The public would have to turn its back on any and all rocket-powered space endevours. It was CONGRESS that killed the Apollo Program,not the President.
"The leader y'all elected" is the President, not dictator, and has not given any indication of an inclination to turn away from our space programs. Of course, IF the voting public demands it, Congress will have to obey the "will of the people". The President's signature will then be only the final step in the process.
BAMANBLAZERFAN Wrote:Of course, IF the voting public demands it, Congress will have to obey the "will of the people".
Good one. Because that matters so much to them.
(11-09-2009 12:08 PM)BAMANBLAZERFAN Wrote: [ -> ] (11-09-2009 10:47 AM)BlazerPhil Wrote: [ -> ] (11-09-2009 01:57 AM)BAMANBLAZERFAN Wrote: [ -> ] (11-08-2009 11:12 PM)LightEmUp70 Wrote: [ -> ] (11-08-2009 10:02 PM)BAMANBLAZERFAN Wrote: [ -> ] (11-03-2009 04:49 PM)BatesUAB Wrote: [ -> ] (11-03-2009 02:55 PM)BAMANBLAZERFAN Wrote: [ -> ]#2 I think Lincoln, AL holds that distinction. Germany has Vance and Mobile, South Korea has Montgomery.
And right now are likely the most prosperous cities in our state. Japan, Germany and South Korea are about the only things going for Alabama.
You are correct since those companies have found it to be so much cheaper to hire non-union Alabama laborers who expect little from a company than to employ workers in their own countries who expect higher pay and greater benefits. When you add in the tax evasion laws they have in their favor, they are in the best possible place for their profit margins. And if Alabama workers get "uppity", they can always threaten to move elsewhere because lots of states would love to get those jobs for their workers and would bribe them just like we did to get them. Alabama has a long history of selling its people to lowest bidders.
BTW, I will not "hold my breath" until the state industrial search agency brings anything to "Imperial Jeffco"-- they never have and probably never will. Any excuse for that fact will do.
I know people who have worked in the AL auto plants. They have the right to unionize but don't because they come out better not having to pay dues. Some people actually like working and thinking for themselves.
BTW, you forgot about the Toyota plant in Huntsville. Another one of the most prosperous cities in AL and one of the best places to live in the US.
With its engineering/technology employment base, the Toyota plant is not the big deal it is in Huntsville as it is in the other areas. Unless the space programs shut down and NASA goes out of business, Huntsville will be doing just fine regardless of auto plants (but they are a good addition anyway). I'm really happy for Huntsville because when the legislature was forced by von Braun's threats to set up UAH, they also set up UAB while they were about it.
MDA, NASA, DOD & AMC are all just a stroke of the pen by the leader y'all elected from being empty buildings. And the 1st to go will be the contractors for each organization, with there being a 3 to 1 contractor ratio. Only 3 more years.
That "stroke of the pen" can ONLY happen if the Congress writes it into a bill it passes and sends to the President to sign. What would have to transpire in order for that eventuality to come about? The public would have to turn its back on any and all rocket-powered space endevours. It was CONGRESS that killed the Apollo Program,not the President.
"The leader y'all elected" is the President, not dictator, and has not given any indication of an inclination to turn away from our space programs. Of course, IF the voting public demands it, Congress will have to obey the "will of the people". The President's signature will then be only the final step in the process.
Um, actually, no. The President has line item veto for MDA, several NASA programs, and a bunch of other stuff based here in Huntsville, including the program I work on.
And maybe you missed how the Health Care Reform Bill was railroaded through the House?
The will of the people is not even a glimmer in the distance to the representatives that passed the bill. The supposed 50% of America that wants the bill passed isn't going to contribute one thin dime to fund it. And the Democrats are trying to weave troop support dollars into the health care bill, in an attempt to paint those that don't support the bill as unpatriotic. McCarthyesque politics at the best, and down right illegal IMO.
(11-09-2009 01:57 AM)BAMANBLAZERFAN Wrote: [ -> ]With its engineering/technology employment base, the Toyota plant is not the big deal it is in Huntsville as it is in the other areas.
I'm pretty sure the people in Toney and the surrounding area would disagree especially with the money they gave to the schools and such.
Also, you might want to look up the difference between white collar and blue collar jobs. The Toyota plant serves a different subgroup.
(11-09-2009 08:33 PM)LightEmUp70 Wrote: [ -> ] (11-09-2009 01:57 AM)BAMANBLAZERFAN Wrote: [ -> ]With its engineering/technology employment base, the Toyota plant is not the big deal it is in Huntsville as it is in the other areas.
I'm pretty sure the people in Toney and the surrounding area would disagree especially with the money they gave to the schools and such.
Since you brought it up, by what method did the people give to the schools? By "voluntary contributions, property taxes voted by the community (the method used by Mtn. Brook,AL), occupation tax (used in Jeffco) or some other method of raising money for the local schools. Vance, Lincoln, and the area south of Montgomery do not have the major diverse industrial base of metro Huntsville. For those towns, the auto industry is the "alpha and omega" of good manufacturing jobs there.
Also, you might want to look up the difference between white collar and blue collar jobs. The Toyota plant serves a different subgroup.
I had not mentioned the Toyota plant because I didn't know about it. How is it different from Honda in Lincoln or Mercedes in Vance in regard to the cited "collar" jobs?
(11-10-2009 01:06 AM)BAMANBLAZERFAN Wrote: [ -> ] (11-09-2009 08:33 PM)LightEmUp70 Wrote: [ -> ] (11-09-2009 01:57 AM)BAMANBLAZERFAN Wrote: [ -> ]With its engineering/technology employment base, the Toyota plant is not the big deal it is in Huntsville as it is in the other areas.
I'm pretty sure the people in Toney and the surrounding area would disagree especially with the money they gave to the schools and such.
Since you brought it up, by what method did the people give to the schools? By "voluntary contributions, property taxes voted by the community (the method used by Mtn. Brook,AL), occupation tax (used in Jeffco) or some other method of raising money for the local schools. Vance, Lincoln, and the area south of Montgomery do not have the major diverse industrial base of metro Huntsville. For those towns, the auto industry is the "alpha and omega" of good manufacturing jobs there.
Also, you might want to look up the difference between white collar and blue collar jobs. The Toyota plant serves a different subgroup.
I had not mentioned the Toyota plant because I didn't know about it. How is it different from Honda in Lincoln or Mercedes in Vance in regard to the cited "collar" jobs?
I just said you forgot about it. You indicated it wasn't as big of a deal which I disagree due to the fact that it serves the blue collar jobs unaffected by the engineering jobs you referenced earlier. In that sense it is the exact same as the plants in Lincoln and Vance, but very different from many of the jobs in Huntsville.
As far as what they have provided to schools. They donated large sums of money to surrounding schools (Sparkman was one, I believe. My wife knows more about it since she is from that area). They have also provided needed jobs for those in the areas outside of Huntsville (it is located in an area that was Toney, but was annexed by Huntsville when they moved in). This is big for an area that's almost exclusively relegated to cotton, soy, and winter wheat.
(11-08-2009 10:02 PM)BAMANBLAZERFAN Wrote: [ -> ] (11-03-2009 04:49 PM)BatesUAB Wrote: [ -> ] (11-03-2009 02:55 PM)BAMANBLAZERFAN Wrote: [ -> ]#2 I think Lincoln, AL holds that distinction. Germany has Vance and Mobile, South Korea has Montgomery.
And right now are likely the most prosperous cities in our state. Japan, Germany and South Korea are about the only things going for Alabama.
You are correct since those companies have found it to be so much cheaper to hire non-union Alabama laborers who expect little from a company than to employ workers in their own countries who expect higher pay and greater benefits. When you add in the tax evasion laws they have in their favor, they are in the best possible place for their profit margins. And if Alabama workers get "uppity", they can always threaten to move elsewhere because lots of states would love to get those jobs for their workers and would bribe them just like we did to get them. Alabama has a long history of selling its people to lowest bidders.
BTW, I will not "hold my breath" until the state industrial search agency brings anything to "Imperial Jeffco"-- they never have and probably never will. Any excuse for that fact will do.
God you are stupid.
(11-08-2009 10:02 PM)BAMANBLAZERFAN Wrote: [ -> ] (11-03-2009 04:49 PM)BatesUAB Wrote: [ -> ] (11-03-2009 02:55 PM)BAMANBLAZERFAN Wrote: [ -> ]#2 I think Lincoln, AL holds that distinction. Germany has Vance and Mobile, South Korea has Montgomery.
And right now are likely the most prosperous cities in our state. Japan, Germany and South Korea are about the only things going for Alabama.
You are correct since those companies have found it to be so much cheaper to hire non-union Alabama laborers who expect little from a company than to employ workers in their own countries who expect higher pay and greater benefits. When you add in the tax evasion laws they have in their favor, they are in the best possible place for their profit margins. And if Alabama workers get "uppity", they can always threaten to move elsewhere because lots of states would love to get those jobs for their workers and would bribe them just like we did to get them. Alabama has a long history of selling its people to lowest bidders.
BTW, I will not "hold my breath" until the state industrial search agency brings anything to "Imperial Jeffco"-- they never have and probably never will. Any excuse for that fact will do.
Of course it's cheaper. People in Detroit were making the equivalent of $80/hr by putting lug nuts on a SUV. I'm a freaking nurse who saves lives and I don't make close to that. Organized labor had its time back when people had inhumane and unsafe working conditions, but now it's just a way to extort more money out of the people who write the checks. Biting the hand that feeds you isn't very smart.
(11-08-2009 11:12 PM)LightEmUp70 Wrote: [ -> ]Huntsville ... one of the best places to live in the US.
Don't get me wrong. I am delighted to have the automakers and rocket scientists in Alabama and hope the German steel makers and European airplane builders (Airbus) also make a home in my home state. Anyone who thinks they are beating a path to our door for any other than economic advantage doesn't know business. Cheaper labor costs and freedom from paying state taxes are big components of their choices made to come here. American industry used to move jobs to the South for these reasons, and now the Europeans and Asians are doing the same thing. We can hope that these industries will eventually work out to our advantage as a state revenue source when their tax-free years run out. Meanwhile we are just glad to have jobs in this economy.
BAMANBLAZERFAN Wrote:Anyone who thinks they are beating a path to our door for any other than economic advantage doesn't know business.
Wow, you're a financial guru! You mean businesses will take advantage of an opportunity to make a higher profit without sacrificing quality? Amazing! You've unlocked the secret! You should write a book about it.
What I don't understand is how people can bitch and moan about these companies getting tax breaks to come here. Here are our two options:
1. Offer huge incentives to them, lure them into the state to employ thousands of people directly and indirectly, thereby generating more income which can be taxed, and more money in the hands of Alabamians to be spent- which can also be taxed, and continue to make money off the company years down the road.
2. Have the attitude that bamanblazer has- i.e. don't give incentives to these huge union hating evil corporations (he uses the term "tax evasion laws")- the end result being we have a state without MB, Honda, Hyundai, Thyssen-Krupp, Airbus. No jobs created, no stream of income. They would rather have NOTHING than have companies lured here by giving them enormous tax breaks. The argument is "We're not making anything off of them because of the tax breaks." Even if this is true (and it isn't)- it is an asinine argument argument because the alternative HAS THE SAME RESULT. It is nothing but liberal, anti-corporate wealth envy. I get so damn angry at the ignorance I just want to take an axe handle and start hitting stuff with it.
(11-13-2009 11:33 AM)BatesUAB Wrote: [ -> ]What I don't understand is how people can bitch and moan about these companies getting tax breaks to come here. Here are our two options:
1. Offer huge incentives to them, lure them into the state to employ thousands of people directly and indirectly, thereby generating more income which can be taxed, and more money in the hands of Alabamians to be spent- which can also be taxed, and continue to make money off the company years down the road.
2. Have the attitude that bamanblazer has- i.e. don't give incentives to these huge union hating evil corporations (he uses the term "tax evasion laws")- the end result being we have a state without MB, Honda, Hyundai, Thyssen-Krupp, Airbus. No jobs created, no stream of income. They would rather have NOTHING than have companies lured here by giving them enormous tax breaks. The argument is "We're not making anything off of them because of the tax breaks." Even if this is true (and it isn't)- it is an asinine argument argument because the alternative HAS THE SAME RESULT. It is nothing but liberal, anti-corporate wealth envy. I get so damn angry at the ignorance I just want to take an axe handle and start hitting stuff with it.
+1
What time limits were placed on the tax breaks given these industries to entice them to Alabama? The state may well have given millions, maybe billions by that time, in tax abatements, spent millions of our tax dollars in land development (grading and such) and access roads construction, utility provisions and general support for job training,etc.
Is our state such an ugly "daughter" that we have to bribe suitors to go out with her? Apparently many see nothing wrong with a state being used and abused to get some industrial attention that we prefer "rape" to being ignored. These German, Asian and other European industries did not move to the "rust belt" for the reasons Dfarr cited. They came South for good, sound, profitable economic reasons--for them. Because apparently, we can't get businesses to look this direction any other way, and now we are PROUD of that? Dr. Flynt's book title is apparently correct: "Po' but PROUD".
I remember when, in 1978, USX layed off 32,000 workers when they closed their plants. Years later they built and opened new mills and announced they would hire about 4,000 employees and would give preference to those former workers who could pass the tests given to qualify for the training program. They later announced that not enough of these former workers had qualified so USX was having to bring in a lot of employees from their Gary, IN plant so they could start up. Maybe THAT lesson explains why Alabama must bribe industries to come to our state.
Alabamians are dependent upon foreigners for our best employment opportunities and on the Federal Government for money to keep running our state services on a daily basis (Almost EVERY program the state has is "thanks to a grant from such and such Federal Agency") and then we turn around and complain about the government spending? We have developed as a state the same sense of ENTITLEMENT we see "conservatives" complain about in the poor and unemployed.
You're right. Let's not do anything to lure industry here. Let's just wallow in the 19th century. You do realize that tax abatements do not cost us one dime, right? But, f it. Who needs thousands of good paying stable jobs?
(11-16-2009 11:44 AM)BatesUAB Wrote: [ -> ]You're right. Let's not do anything to lure industry here. Let's just wallow in the 19th century. You do realize that tax abatements do not cost us one dime, right? But, f it. Who needs thousands of good paying stable jobs?
When ANYONE who should pay taxes is excused from that responsibility, the costs of government do not decrease, they are redistributed to those who DO pay taxes. It's the same as when shoplifters steal from a store--the costs are passed on to those who honestly pay through higher prices. When an industry makes a lot of money but pays no taxes, the costs don't disappear, they are passed on to the tax payers to cover. As has been stated before, "There is no such thing as a "free" lunch".
As I stated ealier on this thread, I'm glad to have those jobs even under the circumstances we got them. I just wish we could get good jobs in our state without the need to give so much away. As Alabama comes into the next decade, will it still be necessary to "tie a porkchop (tax breaks and other give-aways) around the necks of our workers so the dogs (national and international businesses) will "play" with us"?
If you honestly believe that Hyundai, Honda, MB and T-K are a net loss for Alabama, you are much more ignorant on our situation than I previously thought.
(11-16-2009 10:46 PM)BAMANBLAZERFAN Wrote: [ -> ] (11-16-2009 11:44 AM)BatesUAB Wrote: [ -> ]You're right. Let's not do anything to lure industry here. Let's just wallow in the 19th century. You do realize that tax abatements do not cost us one dime, right? But, f it. Who needs thousands of good paying stable jobs?
When ANYONE who should pay taxes is excused from that responsibility, the costs of government do not decrease, they are redistributed to those who DO pay taxes. It's the same as when shoplifters steal from a store--the costs are passed on to those who honestly pay through higher prices. When an industry makes a lot of money but pays no taxes, the costs don't disappear, they are passed on to the tax payers to cover. As has been stated before, "There is no such thing as a "free" lunch".
As I stated ealier on this thread, I'm glad to have those jobs even under the circumstances we got them. I just wish we could get good jobs in our state without the need to give so much away. As Alabama comes into the next decade, will it still be necessary to "tie a porkchop (tax breaks and other give-aways) around the necks of our workers so the dogs (national and international businesses) will "play" with us"?
I don't recall any state tax increases since the car plants et al have come to Alabama. Please correct me if I'm wrong.
Honda got $55.6 million in tax breaks. Mercedes didn't get any tax breaks, just land and employee training. Hyundai got a total packed worth $252 million which included land and training, but I'm unsure about the tax breaks, if any. Hyundai also invested $1 billion into their plant. The automotive industry employs over 35,000 people thanks to these companies. This is how the government is actually useful in spurring the economy. They didn't just hand money over to failing companies. They gave successful companies reasons to invest in the state.
You are correct about tax increases in Alabama. The Legislature doesn't raise taxes, it just redistributes the income from existing taxes that they can. About 87% of our state's income is "ear-marked"(the highest % in the nation) so they just work in the remaining 13% to cover what they can.