NCAAbbs

It looks like somebody in the media besides Trey is laying it all out there:

http://www.tricities.com/tri/sports/coll..._it/10229/

Wow. Yeah, that qualifies as "scathing".
Thank you YET AGAIN Brian Smith!!!!

dammmm.... two in one day with the mention of the evil weevil... I'll bet there are some emails moving today!!

So, does this force the hand of andrews to declare his intent? What will his new fan club at Morehead have to think about this? Inquiring minds want to know!!!

That's my favorite article so far

But what if it is Andrews? It's not like we have a say in anything anyways. It's all back room meetings and crap just like Smith said. We have very little hope IMHO to do anything about a new president.

A big thank you to Brian Smith and to Trey Williams for those articles. ETSU fans and alumni are grateful for this type of writing in our local media. I still believe the power of the press will have the ultimate effect of reinstating football and getting the athetic department back to some semblance of normalcy. Thanks again!

Fan1, what you said has certainly happened in the past, and something I hope everybody on here has learned from. Hopefully, with these articles and BFFF getting the word out, Wayne Andrews candidacy will be over before it even begins.

I also think we will have some sort of say in the search. You can bet if the TBR gets 200-300 letters requesting a pro-football president, they will think twice before considering someone with Andrews' track record (and you can bet it will probably be 200-300 more letters than they've ever received before regarding a presidential search). There has also been and will continue to be pressure from the political side of things. Hopefully there'll be so much pressure that a president who's not about finding a way to make football happen won't even be considered.

I think PFKATD (the doctor) is right, it's just a matter of time before football returns. We just need to help push things along a bit.

Where do we send letters to guys ? What is the best way to approach this ?

http://www.tbr.state.tn.us/about/default...78_btnlink

Link to the board members and addresses. The key is to make sure that your state representatives that pushed the house/senate resolutions are also hearing from you... they are THE KEY to making sure the TBR members understand the full-scope of this search and the ultimate decision to return football to the region: access to opportunity for football student athletes, band members, other student areas such as journalism and athletic training; economic impact of the area; committment to the traditional undergraduate student experience; renewed ties for alumni; return the visibility of ETSU to regional and national prominence through the avenue of athletics ... build the list and let's get going!!!

State Senate:
http://www.legislature.state.tn.us/senat...s.htm#Find
House Reps: http://www.legislature.state.tn.us/house...s.htm#Find

US Congressional Representatives:
http://www.tennesseeanytime.org/government/elected.html

U.S. Senators from Tennessee
Senator Lamar Alexander
Senator Bob Corker

U.S. House of Representatives from Tennessee
David Davis, 1st District
John Duncan, 2nd District
Zach Wamp, 3rd District
Lincoln Davis, 4th District
Jim Cooper, 5th District
Bart Gordon, 6th District
Marsha Blackburn, 7th District
John Tanner, 8th District
Steve Cohen, 9th District

You all don't have to worry about Andrews. Morehead State just extended his contract through 2012.
Article

That's probably a direct result of Stanton's retirement, but regardless it's wonderful news.

I doubt there's a buyout clause in his contract... (ha, that was funny), this one only works one-way and won't be worth the paper it's written on if Jpow decides to pay enough in free bus rides, stale cookies, and golf at the Ridges... that is a nice chunk of change, hopefully he's sooooooooo excited he'll just stay in the bluegrass and retire... good luck to him at morehead!!!

I think non-scholarship football is a good starting point, but the conference shouldn’t stop there. The Atlantic Sun needs to come up with a strategic plan to take football from non-scholarship to competing in Division I-AA.

However, my view of this happening is very pessimistic at this time. I have communicated with Ted Gumbart, (Atlantic Sun Conference Commissioner), but have received no real answer; he seems very unmotivated and somewhat satisfied with the status quo.

Bob Pope (Athletic Director) at Mercer is also very satisfied with the status quo and wants to do things as cheaply as possible. I don’t believe Gumbart and Pope realize what football can do for a University.

I also think the Atlantic Sun could do a better job marketing its teams in other sports as well.

My opinion of the management of Athletics at both the Altantic Sun Conference and Mercer University is very negative at this time. I have been writing letters all summer. I would invite you to do the same; send Gumbart and Athletic Directors at Atlantic Sun schools e-mails and letters telling them why and how football could work for the Atlantic Sun.

I know this is a bit fanatical, but I believe if enough people e-mail, send letters, etc… The conference and the member schools will have to take notice. I have posted names, e-mails, and addresses for Gumbart and several Athletic Directors of member schools below.

Ted Gumbart:
tgumbart@atlanticsun.org
Atlantic Sun Conference
3370 Vineville Ave., Suite 108-B
Macon, GA 31204
478/474-3394
fax 478/474-4272

Bob Pope:
pope_ba@mercer.edu
Mercer University Athletics
1400 Coleman Avenue
Macon, GA 31207-0001
Macon, Ga. 31207-0001
Phone: (478) 301-2994

Jeff Altier
jaltier@stetson.edu
Director of Athletics
Stetson University
Athletics Department | Unit 8359
421 North Woodland Boulevard
DeLand, Florida 32723
Phone Number : 386.822.8100

Mike Strickland
stricklandm@mail.belmont.edu
Director of Athletics
Belmont University
1900 Belmont Boulevard
Nashville, TN 37212-3757
Phone: 615-460-6420
Fax: 615-460-5584

Dr. Steve Potts
steve.potts@lipscomb.edu
Director of Athletics
Main Office: (615) 966-5850 • FAX: (615) 966-1806
Mailing Address:
Lipscomb Athletics
One University Park Drive
Nashville, TN 37204

Dr. Dave Waples
dwaples@kennesaw.edu
Athletic Director
1000 Chastain Rd.
Building 2 Kennesaw, GA 30144

I think you are missing the point CWG. We want football back at ETSU so we can get out of this conference. We arent looking to stay in it.

Fan1- Yes and no.

Do I want football back? Yes.

Might I rather see football return as an independent and stay in the A-Sun? Depends on what the options are.

As it stands right now, I'd rather do that than become a full member of the OVC.

The math doesn't really add up for ETSU to join any other conference at this time.

If you'd really like to know what I'd like to do, it would be to try for Division I-A status in football. Why not think big?

I think that's the best way to try and do this. While I'll admit ETSU v. Temple won't make anyone forget Tennessee-Alabama, I think it will attract more attention than ETSU v. Tennessee-Martin, and would make ETSU seem much more big time.

I have to disagree Pitt. I think scholarship football in the Big South would be GREAT for ETSU, and would serve the other athletic teams as well. Coastal is really good in golf, Radford has a solid tennis program to rival ETSU, we all know about Winthrop, CCU also is working on building up, as well as UNC-A. Football wise it's a conference that while doesn't compare to the Bit Sky or the Southern, is one that we can build a program in, win some games, and garner some interest. And aside from ALL THAT, the only teams that are a tougher driving distance (more than three hours) are the beach schools and VMI, who used to be an old SoCon rival. Their overrall RPI sucks in basketball, but they have some good teams, and ETSU would make it go up.

I would take the Big South in a heartbeat. Plus, they are looking for football schools.

Where did I say that I would be opposed to a move to the Big South?

I'm in agreement for all the reasons mentioned, which are the same reasons I mentioned when ETSU was shopping for a new conference in 2004. It was where I wanted the Bucs to land, especially since the football option would still be on the table.

But you have to ask yourself, where is the space? I'd like to go Division I-A eventually, but I don't know where a new football playing school would fit in up there.

Certain things are going to break between now and then, however. All I say is don't limit yourself. UCF was in the A-Sun for all sports except football until recently. Now they are in Conference USA.

So if such a move would be possible by duplicating the UCF model (which it may or may not be, nobody can say for sure now), wouldn't you rather tred water in this pool for awhile rather than dive right into another pool that might not provide the same options for the future?

if you want fb back - put your money where your mouth is. lots of horn but no beef - and thats the problem. who wants to step up and underwrite this program. nobody

What about all the other sports at ETSU? Nobody is "putting their money where their mouth is" for them. Maybe they should drop those too.

Look, if you're not an ETSU fan, this is none of your business. If you are, step up and realize that football is the premier sport in college athletics and we're wasting our money on other sports without it if we want to be a nationally known university.

And PS - we did put our money where our mouth is last year - over $400K in 3 months. No other sport in ETSU history has ever raised that much money that fast.

Horn- Your comments sound like they were scripted for you by Paulie or Mullins. We want rid of people like you that think small and are small.

There were donors ready and willing to put big money into the football program ($400k up front money was given, not pledged, but cash money). The band program and all other sports programs would have received support if ETSU got serious about having a real athletic program. What happened? Paulie shot them down again after personally promising these donors that he would support the return of football if they met his criteria. They met his criteria and what did they get? He dumped them again using a stupid student vote that was never mentioned to the football group and was never required by TBR as Paulie asserted. This was just the adminstrations way of trying to be political correct to the public by saying, " I tried to bring back football but the students didn't vote for it. That statement has been recognized by the media, the sports supporters, and the public for what it was, a cop-out.

Paulie and his cronies have nickled and dimed the athletic program to death. They have run off good coaches and athletic directors and replaced them with poor ones. Their hiring pratices have been awful. They have killed off many a supporter and have put forward many statements that have not been in the best interest of ETSU, the students, the athletic program and the surrounding communities. The adminstration has systematically killed support for athletics with these antics.

Thanks for retiring early Paulie and say no to Wayne Andrews, a Paulie cronie.

i am not arguing against fb - love the sport, love the bucs. however, no one seems to be writing any checks. while $400,000 is nothing to sneeze at - it is only a pittance of what we need. also, our fb teams have a history of not being particularly good, and our attendance has generally been spotty. what is going to change that. many of us on here run businesses - most of us do not operate on the "if they build it they will come" philosophy

Four hundred thousand dollars for a program that does not exist is nothing to sneeze at, either.

As far as history, I think the fact the program used to be a loser isn't all that relevant, because what an undermanned ETSU team did in 2002 doesn't really have that much bearing on what a new team would do in 2015.

It is like saying you think the "New Cleveland Browns" will win the Super Bowl this year because the "Old Cleveland Browns" were good in the '50s. It doesn't make much sense.

Attendance is another matter. I've often said I don't think this is a good sports area.

I think you have to do something new. I think you have to present the Tri-Cities with something other than an outdoor stadium. You have to present them with the idea that the football program will be something different than it was. A winning team and the pathway to lead ETSU to the big time.

Now, the dirty little secret here is that if Appalachian State suddenly goes 3-8 for three straight years, they aren't drawing, either. Neither are the Vols or any team, for that matter.

It is agreed, however, that a few local millionaires not funding the playgrounds of the wealthy (Golf Center) and instead pledging this to football would greatly improve the effort.

dogood- I run a business too. I have spent money to improve my facility each and every year that I have owned it. By keeping up with or being ahead of the my competition, my company has improved sales by an average of 25% per year. If I hadn't made the improvements, my company would be in real trouble. Does this have familiar ring? ETSU let what few facilities that had on campus got to pot. They did not build any new or improve athletic facilities after the Dome was built, while schools large and small continued to build facilities, improve their programs and attract both monetary and fan support. Please do not use the golf facility as something that ETSU built. That facility was built over the objections and interfence by Paulies cronies because Bill Greene and his group of supporters went to Paulie and told him either get his cronies out of the way or kiss the project goodby. Paulie had the good sense to call the "dogs" off and ETSU's golf program got a cutting edge golf facility built and payed for by private monies.

There was a study done at the request of athletic director Todd Stansberry and headed up by Eddie D. to document what each school in the Southern Conference had done or planned to do to inprove their athletic facilities. Every school except ETSU had built/renovated or were in the process of building or renovating football, basketball and baseball facilities, plus they were slowly upgrading the minor sports. When this report was presented to Paulie and his cronies it was received with apathy. You know the rest of the story. Teams falter, athletic director quits, coaches quit, fans lose interest, donations drop and the final staw....ETSU kicked out of Southern Conference and limps into the A-Suck.

I don't know what kind of business you run, but if you use the same business model that ETSU has put in place for their athletic department (one that no other university or college has adopted), I hope you either have no competition or deep pockets, because their model hasn't and won't work in the business world.

do not disagree. one has to to be moving forward or your are behind (to spout a cliche). however, we are where we are now. if we are to move forward - it will take a pretty significant infusion of resources. where do we get this. the problems are pretty easy to discern - its actually making the solutions a reality that is a problem

Donations are not down. BASA giving is actually higher now than it's ever been, as are marketing revenue dollars and network sponsorships. Those numbers are public record and reported on to BASA board members each month.

Would things be better with football? No one argues that having football would be nice. Would it be better if we were still in the SoCon? Sure.

But the total doom and gloom is not reality. Truth is BucTen is talking about new facilities. Well, new facilities are being completed as we speak. Things could be better and they can always be better, but don't totally think things are in the toilet.

'02, are those BASA numbers on the internet? Can you provide a link? If not, where can I get them because I would love to see where the donations are coming from. I can't imagine donations are up when just about everyone I know has stopped giving. It must not be from individual fans or they're manipulating numbers again.

Not only that, but why would you build a softball stadium and soccer field ahead of a new arena? It makes no sense.

Where will the money come from for a new arena? How about a joint partnership with the city?

Even better, where's the money coming from for a new softball stadium?

Tell you my guess, and '02 please correct me if I'm wrong - saying nothing confirms what I'm already pretty certain of - but I'm pretty sure that they are now (for the most part) taking the private donations that used to go to BASA for scholarships and putting it towards new facilities. The new student fees are going to pay for the scholarships the donations used to cover. If I understand right, they can not use student or state money for facilities, so it must all come from public donations. So I suspect that by giving an unrestricted donation to BASA, you actually end up giving money to support the softball/soccer/etc stadium. It's all just a shell game and one that Brian Smith ought to look into if he hasn't already. Because if that's the case, I bet a lot of donors would feel like they've been misled by where their unrestricted donations have gone. It would certainly be a huge story.

I think it would be a win win for JC and ETSU to team up and build a new football stadium and basketball arena.. Of course, you would need a new president at ETSU who believes in sports, and a much more progressive city government to make this happen.. JC seems to have been in a conservative funk for several years now while Kingsport is kicking their butts with new growth.. I would like to see a new city/ETSU sports complex with maybe a convention center and hotel(s).
If you could combine funds from both the city and the university and get some corporate sponsors involved this could be a huge tax boost for the city and the university could play sports in a say a $100 million complex with a $50 million investment.. Maybe they could sell bonds, get big and small donors involved??? Just a dream, I guess , but JC is getting a new mayor and ET is getting a new pres????????

etsualumni00,

From your posts in the past it's obvious you support the return of football and are not a fan of Stanton. However, I think you're barking up the wrong tree on the unrestricted giving going for facilities theory. Truth is the BASA gifts have to go for scholarships now, because they've built their entire business plan on that. Those financials are given to the board regularly, which has oversight so those funds are not being misappropriated. Just not true.

Again, it's a misconception to think that donations went down with the loss of football. I think the point was, has always been, and was proven by the facts -- that football really never brought in a lot of private giving to begin with (something like $128,000 in five years after the great "We are going to lose football if we don't do something" task force of 1998). It's just a fact, but I'm not saying football doesn't still need to return. We just need to look at it for what it was and would be in the future.

Please don't take this as a football bashing post. It's not that at all. I just think sometimes the anger about football makes some of us on here look for anything to bash the athletic department. Truth is some good things are happening and like it or not there are two facilities being completed RIGHT NOW. That's two more than were completed in 30 years (if you don't count the WGCC).

Congratulations, the only problem is there were more people at the "poorly attended" Playoff football game than will be in both those stadiums combined all next season. Great foresight by the so-called powers that be.

Was the widely used $128,000 restricted or unrestricted giving? If restricted, how much of the unrestricted giving was donated by football supporters?

How many letters to alumni were sent out by the great "We are going to lose football if we don't do something" task force of 1998?

How much private giving plus revenue does soccer generate? What about track? What about tennis? Volleyball? Baseball? We should recognize these teams for what they are...money losers. I don't think we should drop any of these sports but if we are going to use the "football lost a bunch of money excuse" shouldn't we use it for all sports.

What's the budget for men's golf, men's baseball, men's tennis, men's track & field, men's cross country and men's soccer? Let's assume it's similar to football. What is better for the school, students, region, etc. Playing football and dropping the above sports or playing the above sports and dropping football.

Buc, I think your spot on.

ETSU administrators (the BIG boys in Dossett) should recognize that athletics is no different than any other university program or area of study. It's all an investment that should not be held to some "professional" sport business plan of making money. You hit the nail on the head when you state that none of ETSU's sports ultimately finish in the black once you count tickets sold, game guarantees, etc. It should be about the educational experience and the investment in the university campus life.

This means having football should really have little or nothing to do with the bottom line. If that were the way others looked at it, only about 25 or 30 Division I teams would even field football programs, because that's the total number making money today.

To answer your questions, the $128 K was restricted giving straight to football. I don't know how much unrestricted was given, but like I said before, BASA's unrestricted giving is much higher today than it ever was with football.

Don't know about the letters sent by the task force. You would have to ask those people. They were the ones though that ultimately failed to make our fans and alumni realize that the problem was serious.

At the end of the day, it was a failure on the part of presidents dating back to the 50s who failed to understand and support athletics in a way that would make it successful. And even during the great 1980s and 1990s basketball teams, those same heads of the university failed to capitalize on those successes.

We are paying now for their failures in the past, and trying to pick up the pieces.

Let's call the "failures of the past presidents" excuse to be what it is- an excuse.

Paul Stanton had the job for 12 years. After 12 years on the job, you don't get off passing blame to your predecessors.

The fact is Stanton put the athletic program in a worse shape than it has been since they were in the NAIA.

Dating back to the 50s? That's when ETSU went to the NCAA, for crying out loud! Are you suggesting ETSU should have stayed in the NAIA?

You mentioned the 1998 Red Alert warning. Very well. And all Stanton did after that was run off two football minded ADs for a tennis coach.

What kind of follow up was done to the Red Alert warning? NOTHING! THEY LET IT DIE!

Don't pass the buck on to anyone else (except maybe Puppet Mullins). In 1996, under Stanton's predecessor, ETSU had an AD who had his priorities in order, hired great coaches who were reviving down programs, football was nationally ranked and golf had their highest ranking ever.

Now what are we bragging on? Women's basketball in the NCAA from a lousy conference? Golf is twenty spots lower than they were prior to Stanton's arrival?

Put the bum tag, and rightfully so, on Stanton's 12 years. To do anything less, to try to say "Yeah, well, but he did this right" is to give him a pass- and giving him a pass will be the deathnell of improving ETSU athletics.

Let me just say for the record that my wife and I are 2 of "those people" that never received a letter asking for any type of support before football was dropped. She graduated in '99 and I graduated in 2000 and we NEVER got any request, letter, or phone call asking for a donation because football might be dropped. This is one place where Stanton failed the university by not actually making a true effort to save it before it was cut. Someone who truly wanted to save the sport or who was doing a thorough job as President would have made a noticeable effort to save the sport, or at least make people aware that it might be cut. This caught everyone off-guard and has virtually ruined the public image of ETSU.

I just hope now that we can get a president who has the vision and innovation to bring football back to ETSU. There is no reason for this sport not to be played on the campus of one of the largest TBR schools. All the financials are there. Every time I hear the $128K in 5 years, I like to remind people of the $400K in 3 months. This sport has the necessary support, likely more than many of the other TBR schools, and all it needs is the proper leadership to finish the deal. Some money will have to be shifted around and some of the airline flights canceled, but it can be done if someone wants to do it. A president who is unable to accomplish this is not competent to lead this size of a university.

The $128,000 in five years is a joke. There never was a fund raising effort made by the university for football. I dare anyone to produce any material that would support the universities claim that they informed the public about dropping the football programm if monies were not raised to help offset costs. Does anyone think that announcement would not have been in the media.

The task force to drop football was behind-the-door cronie meetings, never made public on purpose.

There was a club formed solely for the support of football. This club was under the fund raising umbrella of the university and all by-laws were NCAA approved. Todd Stansberry, AD, and Paul Hamilton was in total support of this club and attended most of the meetings.

This club could not get any information from the university concerning former football athletes or for that matter any athletes. They told the club that they had no records. The club proceded to gather names and finally put together a mailing list. Greg Stubbs, former football player at ETSU headed up that committee and was really mad at the way the University treated him and the club especially since all monies went to support ETSU football.

The club raised approx. $25k the first year through memberships, shirt sales and donations. It was unbeliveable how many people said they had never been approached to give money to the football program or any program at ETSU.

The club expanded to a membership of approx. 250 and had raised $35k midway through the second year and things were really rolling. A university representative then told the club that ETSU was afraid the club was violating NCAA rules and wanted their books. This was the start of the end for the club.

1. Money was removed from the clubs account and put into general fund without the knowledge of clubs officers. Clubs members were told this is how University handles all accounts that have money in them at the end of their fisical year.

2. PIrate club put out material taking credit for raising monies that club had donated to football. Members really mad.

3. Club was not able to hold money over each year, therefore the club had to spend money or lose it and start all over each year. Membership didn't like that situation. The money raised was for football only, not general fund. Club called other University fund raising groups and none of those had encounterd these types of problems.

4. Club finally got tired of the accusations and the interference of university and disbanded. Club believed it was interfered with on purpose.

5. The University within two years killed an effort by a legally organized loyal group to support football, just like they killed the effort to return football by holding a student election.

6. Oh, by the way, books were given back to club and no wrong doing was found. Isn't it funny how after a club dedicated to supporting football is ruined, that the university found nothing wrong.

People come on this board any make statements concerning the lack of support and lack of money for football. I hope you are making these statements because you are uninformed. If that is the case, that is why several of us take exception to your comments and try to inform you with the truth. Their have been many efforts to support football but all have been rebuffed by the university.
There has been blunder after blunder made by the university and the athletic department. They are solely responsible for the lack of student and community support.

When ETSU decided to kill football they had planned many ways of killing off the program while at the same time preparing their spin doctors to fool the public. Many have been fooled, but truth will win out.

How can anyone see and read what our peer institutions are doing with their athletic programs and continue to argue that ETSU is "doing it the right way".

Bottom line still is that ALL the peer institutions of ETSU have a football program. They cannot keep ignoring that forever.

Ten- Great post.

Two things I want to say. Of course the $127,000 is a joke, but I like to use the $127,000 figure against the $2 million golf facility to show how the powers that be had their priorities out of whack.

Also, in 1998, it was heavily reported the football program had five years to live if additional funding wasn't in place. And essentially nothing happened after that and the media didn't do a whole lot to keep the topic in the public eye.

But your accusations, if true, indicate there was almost an agenda to kill football.

And you know, if Dr. Paul Stanton was one of these guys who believed "football breaks bodies- it does not build them!" then just say that. Be honest. Tell me you are culturally appalled by the sport as a doctor.

I won't agree with that, but at least you'd be honest. At least we'd understand your agenda and though you'd get a lot of flack, you'd get some support and could, theoretically, start a movement.

Don't knock the latter statement. THere are enough people already who are believing everything that comes out of ETSU's mouth.