NCAAbbs

http://www.courant.com/sports/hc-dezfbco...umn?page=1

Yet ANOTHER BE expansion article, this time from a Connecticut newspaper
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Mike Tranghese understands that the topic of Big East football expansion is hotter than fish grease.

But the conference commissioner has maintained — and did again last week — that there are no fish to fry on the issue. Even though the Big East is the smallest BCS-affiliated conference with an unbalanced schedule that forces a disparity in league road games, causes each team to have five nonconference games while most teams in the country have four and has no league championship game with its big payday.

Tranghese said outside of a few coaches who want a ninth team, UConn's Randy Edsall among them, the subject is not on the table with Big East presidents and athletic directors.

"Schools aren't talking to me and I'm not talking to anybody," Tranghese said. "People [from schools interested in joining] call me and I tell them I'm not talking because I'm not authorized. Plus our people have no interest. You get your board members, fans, it's incredible. I have told anybody and everybody it's not happening. Don't bother me."

OK, but what if a deal too sweet to beat existed? Just for kicks, let's put one on the table in the form of, say, a job application. The school should be willing to:

• Play a conference football schedule with zero compensation from the Big East so current members don't have to give up any of their share of revenue.

• Be responsible for negotiating a television contract for home games until the league wants the school to be a part of its package.

• Not expect any of the league's BCS revenue until earning a BCS bid of its own representing the conference.

• Come in as a football member only. Other sports would play in another league in order to not interfere with the league's current 16-member setup for all other sports.

• Show a solid track record of putting fans in the seats at home, on the road and at bowl games — all on a trial basis for a few years.

Who would take that chance?

East Carolina.

Speaking on the condition of anonymity because of the sensitivity of the issue, insiders with knowledge of East Carolina's position talked of doing all of the above.

That's how confident they are in coach Skip Holtz's program. By the way, Skip wouldn't return the call on this one, and athletic director Terry Holland said he had no comment.

Told you it was sensitive.

"We would agree to all of that and others," said one prominent ECU supporter. "Our partnership could be described as a 'hand-in' partnership rather than a 'hand-out' partnership. We wouldn't be asking for anything except the opportunity to prove ourselves as good and productive partners of the eight institutions playing Division I-A football."

The schools that pushed for expanding their leagues and creating league championship games in football did it for the money, but they also did it to ensure their futures.

The Big East has set itself up for life in basketball. In football, we're not so sure.

What happens if Notre Dame, in the Big East for all sports except football, decides it's going to the Big Ten?

What would the Big East do? The league would need to fill Notre Dame's spot. Navy? Memphis? Central Florida? East Carolina?

"We will not take anybody as a federated member," Tranghese said. "We dealt with it before [with Temple]. It didn't work out. We've lived it and we're not going down that path again."

Yeah, Mike, but you let ...

"That happened 13 years ago with Notre Dame. The league was struggling at the time. We had just invited Rutgers and West Virginia and the presidents of the basketball schools said they would like to add a school with a national presence in basketball and other sports, and they agreed to that. Now, if you look at what Notre Dame has done in basketball, cross country, women's basketball for this league, there's no one out there that can come close. When we took them in, there was a clear understanding what it meant in football and [the presidents] understood it.

"As for now, anybody who says I just want to play football ... it's just not happening because the agenda of any institution is to become a full member."

There will be interest in a 16th member again if Notre Dame does go to the Big Ten and takes the rest of its teams, too.

"Look, there are teams out there that could probably help us but they're not available," Tranghese said.

Technically, that's true. After the ACC ripped Miami, Virginia Tech and Boston College from the Big East's mitts, practically every league freaked out in terms of getting exit fees and other penalties together as part of future agreements with member schools. East Carolina, a member of Conference USA, says it would deal with whatever the penalty was to leave.

Whether it's to address the immediate unbalanced schedule issue or the need for a long-term fix if Notre Dame leaves, Memphis, Central Florida and East Carolina should be getting good looks right now.

But it's unlikely that Memphis, Central Florida or any other school would be willing to do what ECU supporters believe the program is willing to do.

Memphis would be a plus in hoops. Central Florida would be fine for recruiting purposes in football. However, neither can boast of having one of the best nonconference football schedules in the country with an SEC feel at homes games like East Carolina can.

Those schools don't have a six-year contract in place with West Virginia. They can't brag about traveling as well as ECU does. ECU is also believed to be open to guaranteeing the purchase of 2,500 tickets to Big East away games.

Think about that. At $40 a pop, that's another $100,000 for the home school in gate money. Notre Dame is the only school in the nation that would even attempt a guarantee like that.

And here is East Carolina, ready to go with that plus a whole lot more, all on a trial basis.

ECU insiders and supporters have convinced yours truly that it is not afraid to take risks — and you can determine that for yourselves when you see their nonconference schedules.

There's no league in the country in a better position to help ECU right now than the Big East — and vice versa. And then there's the future. Will Big East's football league be ready when it comes?

Wonk Wonk Wonk

That article makes ECU sound pathetic. ECU comes off as nothing more than a trailer trash slut willing to give it away for what little attention she gets durring the act knowing as soon as its over he is out the door without so much as a thank you.

ECU is wearing out their knee pads on the BE commish.

That article was not written by anyone associated with ECU.

I guess the guy is clueless on T.V markets like the last go around. I would say Memphis is probably the #1 target, UCF #2, and ECU a distant #3. It would be tough for any team to take a football only invite too. What conference is going to take the rest of the sports as a temporary home? I can't see this happening at all.

Then the other problem. The Big East is not going to expand until at least 2013. They are in no hurry. The C-USA schools will already schedule home and away games with them.

UCF would be the number one choice followed by Memphis. UCF is located in Orlando, has new on campus facilities, is located in Orlando, has over 40,000 students, and its located in Orlando.

It might be a tie...I'm not sure. Memphis has a national hoops team and brings the Liberty Bowl. They played in the championship game. UCF brings a large athletic budget, new facilities, big enrollment, travel partner with South Florida, and C-USA east champs two out of the last 3 years.

I just don't think it is something to get worked up about. The Big East is in a position to wait. You can see ECU throwing the kitchen sink at them and they are still waiting.

I hope the C-USA can build itself up and the BCS crap is finished. The Big East is only more attractive to UCF because of those crappy letters.

Honestly, that is just a sad story to read for any ECU fan with any pride at all.

Like CUSA waited on taking UCF from the MAC and ASUN until it was gutted, all the while sitting on 11 teams. Last I checked they haven't added anyone since the first round so who isn't waiting? If you think your administration is pushing hard your foolish especially the way USF has so minimised your program and owns you in everything. I heard you guys are begging more than anyone.

Keep living the dream but you just got out of the A-Sun and MAC, and the Big East already took their FL school for potential. Taking another one only dilutes the very reason USF was picked and also cuts into Lousiville, Rutgers, West Virginia etc that heavily depend on FL recruiting and have the advantage over you. If you think the Big East is going to do anything to undercut USF at this point while they are on the rise you're fooling youself. Certainly not invite another competitor to set up shop 90 miles away when they can keep them at arms length and dominate them now. Not going to happen, hell USF want even play you guys but yet you think everyone in that league is going to side with you and kill the momentum and advantages they while they are poised to have a top 10 program soon. Get real. Your ship sailed when they added USF.

Your the clueless one. That's a minor factor, and since Trangesse didn't have much to really sale USF on at the time pumped it up. Besides USF already has your market covered. I saw plenty of press in your paper on them this year. If market is what it was about the BE would have kept Temple instead of booting them when they needed teams, all the while Virginia Tech carred them on TV, something like dozens of ESPN games more than anyone on Thursays, and look at their market. Bottomline is unless anyone cares about you in your market it doesn't matter how big it is. You guys are 5th page in yours, and we own our average size one and are an hour away from a similar size market and get 5th page in it as well.

Question, which team in CUSA is the only team with it's own TV deals? ECU...... Question, which team in CUSA is the only school to deliver a major regional TV deal to the conference and have 7 CUSA games shown on it... ECU...... Which team has had their own individual deal with ESPN...ECU, didn't seem to stop them from paying us millions...... Which team has had every game televised some where the last 3 years... We are fine on TV.


That's a major network based in Baltimore and DC and 7 states. Waiting for you guys to deliever a TV deal to the conference. We have deliever two.

Between UCF and ECU which team has two East division titles and one CUSA Title? Which one has zip, nada, zero, none?

ECU has zero conference titles, small market, smaller enrollment, smaller budget, and a worse recruiting location.

Take off your ECU purple glasses for a second and you will see you're pretty lucky to be in the C-USA. The Big East isn't going to expand until at least 2013 so you can keep begging for a little while.

That critera didn't seem to hold USF back or Cincy who won in a tie while 7-7 (real meaningful right). Besides they are BCS, we beat more BCS than any non-BCS....they have actual top 25 teams....we beat actual top 25 teams....we also beat the crap out of the champ of CUSA for what ever that's worth & actually won a bowl. Doubt they put much worth on a CUSA "champion" when a mid level Big East team like USF can pounded the $hit out of them.

Average market look it up, in which we own and pre-empt Notre Dame on the NBC affiliate. We also get 5th page in a simlar market to yours like you do in your own and have drawing power beyond our market for MASN to sign us up and ESPN to as well in the past. Like I said what TV are you delievering? About as much as Temple did for them.

and? When did drive by commuters become a positive......

........oh thats right, here. That's where you can mile them for the #1 student fees in the nation. Budget difference is still small despite that.

Which as I said this go around will be your kryptonite, where before it was the only reason you had life in the talks. Your ship sailed when they added their, done nothing FL team for potiental. Who is doing a lot now because of it and no one is going to do anything to hurt, and USF already has your market covered since you think thats a big deal. We saw the articles and editorials in your hometown paper on them all last season. More positive than anything written on UCF BTW.

That's rich coming from a team we helped let in from the ASun and Mac.

I'm just glad we have a respected AD that's proactive unlike our last AD, hell we didn't even even have an AD last time just an interim one. Call it what you want if your AD isn't doing something similar you're stupid because USF will always minimize you and own you in every sport like they do now otherwise, but I think you are foolish to think your AD isn't trying hard as well.

Has that respected AD gotten any more relatives free money at ECU's expense lately. I would say his respect is pretty low these days.

#1 we do not have the largest athletic fees in the country.

#2 Yes you're in a small market. We will have tons of coverage on T.V. 3 ESPN games (One primetime Saturday) and more CBS sports tv. We had deals with Sun Sport before we came into the C-USA in the past. We delivered the #3 highest rated bowl game on ESPN last year.

#3 Recruiting location matters and we are a travel partner with South Florida for the northern teams. Expenses matter

#4 Basketball - You're not in even close to the same level as UCF

#5 Football - We won the C-USA east 2 out of the last 3 years.

Get it right. It wasn't free, they guy worked a job in the department stacking chairs and cleaning up and received a scholarship for it while finishing up his degree.

It came out later that Holland had asked permission well in advance and received it from the chancellor. Holland has donated thousands and thousands of dollars to ECU since coming on, . I think $50k grand just last year according to the paper and that scholarship was around $18k dollars if my memory serves me correct that was earned not a hand out. I imagine he just wanted to help his brother but for him not to feel like it wasn't a hand out which it wasn't. TH more than earned that right and we were still in the plus with what he had donated.

It was later released that he went through all the correct channels and there was nothing illegal about it, and the chancellor's took responsibility for the screw up of not realizing he signed off on it, which the paper found in his emails. Besides according to Transgesse a few weeks back in a Courant article he is still highly respected and he still sits on a bunch of committees nationally a bunch of your AD's couldn't sniff.

Something to be proud of right there.

It's about 100 out of 200 markets. That's average and we own it, and you still won't touch the fact we get as much coverage in a similar size market near by as you do in your own. More positive coverage in it as well I might add. The fact is you can pump the rest of that TV up but your TV can't touch ours and you haven't deliever anything. The bowl is kind of funny though you bring it up as those people got to see UCF discredit itself in a borefest vs a medicre SEC team. I would rather that didn't happen myself. Just as many people saw us on college gameday put up a strong fight with a top 10 team last year in an emotional event. Plus I would rather them have seen us beating the top 25 america's darling in a bowl even if fewer watched.

Not as much as keeping that team strong and growing into a top 10 program, and keeping Rutgers and Louisville stocked with FL talent instead of diluting it all. FL has already been opened in recruting and USF clearly spilled into your market last year and even got more positive press.

and you still have never been more than an average program and that's 20 spots better than us in the RPI the last decade. Basketball isn't going to decide anything, especially not margainly better. If they wanted basketball they would have taken Memphis last time, and we have actually played in a league that produced 4-6 NCAA bids a year. Besides we got a new coach that is already turning things around and has won games in the NCAA's with a lesser school and beat Kentucky, Marquette, Maryland etc on two nationlly ranked recruits this week. Things are changing..

...and lost to us 2 of the last 3 time like you normally do in your history or lack there of. Not even close.

Whatever helps you sleep though.

Keep living the dream but you just got out of the A-Sun and MAC, and the Big East already took their FL school for potential. Taking another one only dilutes the very reason USF was picked and also cuts into Lousiville, Rutgers, West Virginia etc that heavily depend on FL recruiting and have the advantage over you. If you think the Big East is going to do anything to undercut USF at this point while they are on the rise you're fooling youself. Certainly not invite another competitor to set up shop 90 miles away when they can keep them at arms length and dominate them now. Not going to happen, hell USF want even play you guys but yet you think everyone in that league is going to side with you and kill the momentum and advantages they while they are poised to have a top 10 program soon. Get real. Your ship sailed when they added USF.


sorry im not a ucf fan but i do understand what is wanted. tampa and orlando are not in the same television market. ecu does not bring any market. no one in the dc or maryland market cares about ecu. usf was picked over ucf because they were in the asun and the big east wouldnt stoop that low. usf was a bad cusa team but at least cusa was considered a major basketball conference at the time of the raid. if the big east splits they will want one team to get to nine in football and basketball and the most desirable candidate by far is UCF.

We shall see, but honestly I would rather not be on the doorstep of a program like USF who was added for potiental, and try to sale them ,while they are relizing it and growing into a top 10 program, and the other power teams in the BE like West Virginia, Louisville, and Rutgers that we could share those FL recruits they all have been fueling their program with and have been getting over them. Good luck with that. I think your logic is flawed and I'm not the only one.

That critera didn't seem to hold USF back or Cincy who won in a tie while 7-7 (real meaningful right).

Actually, Cincinnati was 7-6 and they had beat the co-champion (#18 TCU) head-to-head. Cincinnati's huge market also had something to do with it. I wouldn't consider USF a "mid-level" team considering they finished the season in the Top 25. ECU fans like to thumb their noses down at Cincinnati, but Cincinnati earned their spot. I just find it amusing that Cincinnati sharing a conference title, while beating the co-champion isn't considered meaningful, but beating a conference champion while not winning a title yourself is considered meaningful. I guarantee that if ECU won a share of the C-USA title while finishing 7-6 they would be crowing about it endlessly.

Personally I am left to wonder how long the schools in the Big East will tolerate USF's borderline tactics and their amazingly low academics for their teams. A team that was, I believe, #2 for lowest football APR and #10 for lowest basketball APR is an embarrassment for the Big East schools which supposedly pride themselves on their academics.

I think he is more trying to discredit UCF and not disrespecting Cincy. The T.V market is a big deal and the Orlando and Tampa market is completely different. I personally do not think anything will happen for at least 5 years as far as expansion goes. It would be best for the C-USA if things wait for 5 years. Expansion for the C-USA gets ugly if they have to replace 1 or 2 members. I hope the Big East is respectful of the stability of our conference.

I tend to think Texas and anyone else that played at BHNS last year would disagree with that first one. Both stadiums hold about the same number and the noise seems to be pretty good at both. Not minimizing ECU on this one, just not agreeing that they're the only one.

As to the second one...4 game series with Miami and future home games with NC State, Boston College, and apparently a yet as unannounced home-&-home with Wisconsin. Again, not slighting ECU, just disputing the article a bit.

Edit - forgot the quote tags on the article quote

They did until they lost BC and Miami; suddenly, academics were so important that they took 3 schools with exceedingly low academic standards for athletes (not tallking about the school - for athletes). Ciny looks like they've tightened things up, but until recently, they had pretty much no standards.

My question is this: Why isn't Marshall pimping itself to the BE. ECU seems to have this long list of grievances - why doesn't Marshall? OR UCF - a school with a legitimate BE chance - why aren't their fans constantly spreading them on this and the BE board?
Is ECU's pimping good for his league?

Pimping does no good. It looks embarrassing and nobody on the Big East board has a vote.

Do you mean "Home and Away" with Wisconsin?

Your A.D. is good at sniffing allright. Sniffing Transgesse's butt.

Are you kidding me. They are on this board crowing about their Liberty Bowl Alliance championships. They would be ecstatic with what your Bearcats did in winning a share of a CUSA title. Hek, they can't even win a East Division title.

I think he is more trying to discredit UCF and not disrespecting Cincy. The T.V market is a big deal and the Orlando and Tampa market is completely different. I personally do not think anything will happen for at least 5 years as far as expansion goes. It would be best for the C-USA if things wait for 5 years. Expansion for the C-USA gets ugly if they have to replace 1 or 2 members. I hope the Big East is respectful of the stability of our conference.
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If CUSA found itself short a team or two right now then there would be NO replacement. Wait five years or so to see how the Charlotte and UT San Antonio situations progress at which time potential members would be addressed. Adding two from the field available now would kill our tv deals and render the playoff games useless.

Hey usmbacker, and knightime take your heads out of your asses. You guys have such hard ons for ECU that it is so sad. Every time something about ECU is posted you guys have mega huge boners for for putting ECU down in every way. You guys have got to get a life and stop trying to put ECU down every time you come on this board.

I was refering to them being a mid level Big East team, which they were, but they are certainly on the rise.

I can count, you were 7-7 and lost to a Sun Belt team in a bowl, which I wasn't even going to bring up.

http://www.cfbdatawarehouse.com/data/div...?year=2000

That was how significant the championship was that year and many years, but yet some around here think because you win one more game vs conference foes that's the crowning achievment in athletics. It wasn't even a very good season, championship or no championship, that was my point on the meaningfulness. As bad as we were that year even we beat at the time ranked TCU team, and that's how dominated the other co-champ was.

Part of "pimping" is this business of joining the league for football only, but agreeing to take no revenue. I really doubt UCF would take that deal, if offered.

A "home & home series" means both teams are playing at home once. It's used often to describe when major-AQS teams schedule each other for two games, one at each's home field.

What? You don't think there are any viable candidates?

You going to the WAC baseball tournament in Ruston next weekend? 6 of the 7 WAC teams will be playing....

This board is full of haters.
Go ECU.

You quoted me incorrectly. And, no, I am not going to the WAC baseball tournament in Ruston next week end because Tech didnt qualify and wont be playing thus no one else will be there.

Its not knocking ECU guys but the Big East is not expanding...period. They have said that over and over. They are not expanding nor are there any plans to split in 2013. First it was 2-10, now 2013. Doubtless in 2013 it will be 2017 or 2020. This silly speculation may outlast the Republic and the second coming of Christ.

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If CUSA found itself short a team or two right now then there would be NO replacement. Wait five years or so to see how the Charlotte and UT San Antonio situations progress at which time potential members would be addressed. Adding two from the field available now would kill our tv deals and render the playoff games useless.
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I actually think Western Kentucky should be considered if someone leaves. They would bring a solid basketball program to the conference and their football team won a national title in 1-AA a couple of years ago.

Hey KT, your argument about that sucks. Remember, I lived just north of Orlando for almost 3 years, and your TV coverage was pathetic. You want to talk about TV? Will you have more or less games than ECU on TV this season? How about last season? It's not even close. You can't even land a local TV deal in your mega market Orlando, while ECU lands both local and regional deals. Nice try.

Just assuming arrguendo that your post is accurate, ECU's local/regional deal does not benefit the conference. It is viewership on the national games that brings in the $$$. It's not about who is televised more; it's about the $$$ the market represents. ECU may have more games televised locally than UCF, but there's a reason we have more national games.

So we have 3 ESPN/2 games and several CBSC games. I guess you have more than that?

GrayBeard,

We have 3 games on ESPN this year with also several CBSC games. Pretty much every UCF game you can find on T.V and our ratings are strong. We even have a primetime game schedule on Saturday night against South Florida.

The big difference is the getting even a small share of a huge Central Florida market is big $$$. We are the #19 rated T.V market. UCF has over 100,000 alumni in the Central Florida area and 45,000 students. Huge with ad potential, sponsorships, and viewer growth.

To wade through all the extra words, your answer to my question is "NO".

So you don't have any more national exposure than we have, and your local/regional coverage is nowhere near what we have.

Thanks for playing.

I never said your coverage was bad. I know you have 3 ESPN games. My point was directed at the people that minimize the power of a huge market. The Big East gets their huge T.V contract because they have big markets and a few national teams. Getting a share of North Carolina isn't the same as getting Central Florida. Now that Rutgers is playing good football they are a huge asset! Now you hear rumors that the Big 10 might be interested and it is because of the NJ and NY market.

FYI - Our million dollar per year sponsor is "Bright House Networks".

Not sure why you felt the need to spout that out, but as a former customer of "Bright House Networks" I think they would have been better served taking that money and fixing the problems with their digital phone service. It was absolutely pathetic.

You're nuts if you think us landing a MASN TV deal that televised 7 CUSA contest in the DC/Baltimore/Charlotte/Virginia Beach etc and 7 states didn't benefit the conference. The station was available on Direct TV nationally on the same tier as CSTV is and has been for several years.

Our market was fine for ESPN to pay us millions as an indy while you sat there for years without a deal as an indy some of the same years from 1996-when ever you joined the MAC without one. You haven't delivered any major regional deals like the MASN to CUSA, you don't even have a local deal for your city like we do on the NBC affiliate in our average market, and you don't have as many nationally televised games either. It's not like we don't have big ones on ESPN. One is vs Virginia Tech in Charlotte in a bowl type atmosphere to open the season and the other in our stadium vs West Virginia. We own those TV rights for both and delivered them to CUSA.

You guys are 5th page in your market and USF gets more positive press from what I have read and we get as much coverage in a similar size market of which is actually positive. You haven't sniffed a TV deal for this conference, your TV situation & pull obviously can't touch ours or you would have a major regional deal landing 7 CUSA games as well or as much and decent coverage in your market as what we got in Raleigh Durham. Yet you try to say that's an asset for you. Give us a break. USF already showed last year when they got up to #2 they could own the Central FL media area. I read the articles and watched some of the news clips out of Orlando just for kicks. Some of your hometown media even poked fun at you guys for begging to play USF after you played and said you didn't deserve to be on the same field.

UCF

MASN is a hugh plus. They allowed one of our local stations to broadcast the UAB vs. ECU game last year.

We had contracts with Sunsports in the past while we were indy and while in the MAC. It is broadcast statewide in Florida with all these big T.V markets and not just for Direct TV. They just didn't want to pay the big jack like the C-USA wanted.

Anyway, we get pretty good ratings so who knows what will happen in the near future. We already get most of our games on a national level between ESPN/2 plus CBS Sports.

I'm happy you guys get your games regional. I'm hoping UCF gets shown national though. For the record, UCF gets front page sports during the football season in the Sunday paper and not page 5 like you mentioned. That is 800X's better than getting front page of a small town paper.

kt, you are still missing the point. ECU gets at least the same amount of National exposure as your great UCF, plus we get regional & local TV coverage. I know, you just can't admit that I am right.