I posted this on another thread in which some were saying how many more bowls there are now compared to previous eras of Tiger Football and because of that the fact that we have been to 4 bowl games in 5 years is not a very big accomplishment. I believe otherwise and heres why..
There may be alot more bowl games now than there used to be but it still says something when there are 35 BCS teams(thats over half of the 65 total BCS teams) that havent been to bowl games in 4 of the past 5 years.
You say we would have been to more bowl games in the past if there were so many which is probably true but only 4 other times in the history of our program(all 91 seasons) have we been bowl elible 4 times in 5 seasons. In each of the 4 we were actually eligible 5 times in 5 seasons:
'47-'51
'59-'63
'66-'70
'73-'77
If TW can have us bowl eligible this year and next year then he will be responsible for the best 7 years of Tiger football in our history.
You can say what you want about we have a weak schedule and we used to play tougher teams well I call BS on that.
From '47-'51 we were 0-6 vs the mighty SEC. And routinely played schools like: Missouri Mines, NATTC, Centenary, Union, Pensacola Navy, Austin Peay, Tampa, Delta State, Memphis Navy, East Central Oklahoma, and Western Kentucky.
From '59-'63 we were 1-8-1 against the SEC and our schedule included teams like: Stephen F. Austin, Tenn Tech, Abilene Christian, Chatanooga, Texas-Arlington, North Texas State, Hardin-Simmons, VMI, Citadel, Tulsa, Furman, Detroit Mercy, and West Texas A&M.
From '66-'70 we were 1-6 vs the SEC and our schedule included: Quantico Marines, Tulsa, West Texas A&M, Utah State, Louisanna-Lafayette, Florida State, North Texas State, and Wichita State.
From '73-'77 we were 4-7 against the SEC and our schedule included: North Texas State, Tulsa, Florida State, Louisiana-Lafayette, Wichita State, Arkansas State, and Utah State.
In all four era's we had losing records to the SEC and the rest of our schedule those years was fairly weak and in many years weaker than our current schedules. Whats the point in scheduling SEC(or other big time programs) if we are good enough to beat them? We should try to elevate our program to the point where we can beat them but until we consistenly reach that level of play then why add another loss to the schedule.
In my personal opinion, the TW era is one of the two best era's of Tiger Football with the other being the '73-'77 period but no matter how you look at it, the TW era is one of the top 5 with the other four being the aforementioned periods. I truly believe he has done more with less and doubt that many of our previous coaches have been on such an unlevel playing field when it came to resources and facilities. I would love to have an Urban Meyer, Nick Saban, Bobby Petrino, or Mack Brown type big name coach but its just not realistic at Memphis. We have TW and we need to support him and do our best to give hime the resources he needs. If he can't get us to the next level with the proper resources, then and only then should we look to replace him.
For those who believe that these are the glory days of Tiger football, here is a brief history lesson.
Record by decade:
1910s 19-25-2 (43.5%)
1920s 35-43-11 (48.5%)
1930s 39-45-7 (48.6%)
1940s 34-23-1 (58.9%)
1950s 48-44-4 (52.1%)
1960s 70-25-1 (73.8%)
1970s 60-48-1 (55.8%)
1980s 31-74-5 (31.2%)
1990s 45-64-1 (41.5%)
2000s 45-51 (46.9%)
It's not even close.
Everyone agrees that the administration needs to make greater commitments to improving the football facilities (including building an on campus stadium). However, we are getting beat by Sun Belt teams with worse facilities than we have so part of the blame has to rest on Tommy's shoulders.
the other Greg Childers Wrote:For those who believe that these are the glory days of Tiger football, here is a brief history lesson.
Record by decade:
1910s 19-25-2 (43.5%)
1920s 35-43-11 (48.5%)
1930s 39-45-7 (48.6%)
1940s 34-23-1 (58.9%)
1950s 48-44-4 (52.1%)
1960s 70-25-1 (73.8%)
1970s 60-48-1 (55.8%)
1980s 31-74-5 (31.2%)
1990s 45-64-1 (41.5%)
2000s 45-51 (46.9%)
It's not even close.
Everyone agrees that the administration needs to make greater commitments to improving the football facilities (including building an on campus stadium). However, we are getting beat by Sun Belt teams with worse facilities than we have so part of the blame has to rest on Tommy's shoulders.
Skewed, invalid numbers childers, but they do fit your agenda as always. All of the numbers you post are
10 year averages, not 7 like the present. repost this in 2-3 years, depending on when you start and ended your decades.
kpigout Wrote:the other Greg Childers Wrote:For those who believe that these are the glory days of Tiger football, here is a brief history lesson.
Record by decade:
1910s 19-25-2 (43.5%)
1920s 35-43-11 (48.5%)
1930s 39-45-7 (48.6%)
1940s 34-23-1 (58.9%)
1950s 48-44-4 (52.1%)
1960s 70-25-1 (73.8%)
1970s 60-48-1 (55.8%)
1980s 31-74-5 (31.2%)
1990s 45-64-1 (41.5%)
2000s 45-51 (46.9%)
It's not even close.
Everyone agrees that the administration needs to make greater commitments to improving the football facilities (including building an on campus stadium). However, we are getting beat by Sun Belt teams with worse facilities than we have so part of the blame has to rest on Tommy's shoulders.
Skewed, invalid numbers childers, but they do fit your agenda as always. All of the numbers you post are 10 year averages, not 7 like the present. repost this in 2-3 years, depending on when you start and ended your decades.
Tommy West is 9th in coaching winning percentage at Memphis.
How exactly are actual wins and losses skewed and invalid?
all those numbers "prove" is that when there is a determined and public effort made by the adminstration, football wins.
the other Greg Childers Wrote:kpigout Wrote:the other Greg Childers Wrote:For those who believe that these are the glory days of Tiger football, here is a brief history lesson.
Record by decade:
1910s 19-25-2 (43.5%)
1920s 35-43-11 (48.5%)
1930s 39-45-7 (48.6%)
1940s 34-23-1 (58.9%)
1950s 48-44-4 (52.1%)
1960s 70-25-1 (73.8%)
1970s 60-48-1 (55.8%)
1980s 31-74-5 (31.2%)
1990s 45-64-1 (41.5%)
2000s 45-51 (46.9%)
It's not even close.
Everyone agrees that the administration needs to make greater commitments to improving the football facilities (including building an on campus stadium). However, we are getting beat by Sun Belt teams with worse facilities than we have so part of the blame has to rest on Tommy's shoulders.
Skewed, invalid numbers childers, but they do fit your agenda as always. All of the numbers you post are 10 year averages, not 7 like the present. repost this in 2-3 years, depending on when you start and ended your decades.
Tommy West is 9th in coaching winning percentage at Memphis.
How exactly are actual wins and losses skewed and invalid?
1) You gave 10 year samplings, and the 2000's are not done yet.
2) The 2000's started the first day of 2001, just like that is when the new century started.
I like the way you used 2000 as the starting point, sneaking in Rips last year and trying to make it appear as part of Tommy's record. 2001 was Tommy's 1st year, and he is 41-44.
kpigout Wrote:the other Greg Childers Wrote:kpigout Wrote:the other Greg Childers Wrote:For those who believe that these are the glory days of Tiger football, here is a brief history lesson.
Record by decade:
1910s 19-25-2 (43.5%)
1920s 35-43-11 (48.5%)
1930s 39-45-7 (48.6%)
1940s 34-23-1 (58.9%)
1950s 48-44-4 (52.1%)
1960s 70-25-1 (73.8%)
1970s 60-48-1 (55.8%)
1980s 31-74-5 (31.2%)
1990s 45-64-1 (41.5%)
2000s 45-51 (46.9%)
It's not even close.
Everyone agrees that the administration needs to make greater commitments to improving the football facilities (including building an on campus stadium). However, we are getting beat by Sun Belt teams with worse facilities than we have so part of the blame has to rest on Tommy's shoulders.
Skewed, invalid numbers childers, but they do fit your agenda as always. All of the numbers you post are 10 year averages, not 7 like the present. repost this in 2-3 years, depending on when you start and ended your decades.
Tommy West is 9th in coaching winning percentage at Memphis.
How exactly are actual wins and losses skewed and invalid?
1) You gave 10 year samplings, and the 2000's are not done yet.
2) The 2000's started the first day of 2001, just like that is when the new century started.
I like the way you used 2000 as the starting point, sneaking in Rips last year and trying to make it appear as part of Tommy's record. 2001 was Tommy's 1st year, and he is 41-44.
Tommy still has a losing record, and is ninth in career coaching winning percentage. And I didn't sneak the numbers in. They were copied from the University of Memphis Football Media Guide.
I clicked on this thread without too much thought, and was honestly expecting to read something about Tiger Woods.
I know he is a liberal, but has it ever occurred to you that toGC is making sense on this issue? He provides stats while everyone else can only provide personal opinion. Hard for you guys to win in an argument like that.
You say we shouldn't compare it by decades because this one isn't over yet and TW hasn't been here for a full decade. Things aren't getting much better for him though. I really hope this isn't the case, but his winning percentage is probably not going to be getting any better over the next couple of years....
the other Greg Childers Wrote:kpigout Wrote:the other Greg Childers Wrote:kpigout Wrote:the other Greg Childers Wrote:For those who believe that these are the glory days of Tiger football, here is a brief history lesson.
Record by decade:
1910s 19-25-2 (43.5%)
1920s 35-43-11 (48.5%)
1930s 39-45-7 (48.6%)
1940s 34-23-1 (58.9%)
1950s 48-44-4 (52.1%)
1960s 70-25-1 (73.8%)
1970s 60-48-1 (55.8%)
1980s 31-74-5 (31.2%)
1990s 45-64-1 (41.5%)
2000s 45-51 (46.9%)
It's not even close.
Everyone agrees that the administration needs to make greater commitments to improving the football facilities (including building an on campus stadium). However, we are getting beat by Sun Belt teams with worse facilities than we have so part of the blame has to rest on Tommy's shoulders.
Skewed, invalid numbers childers, but they do fit your agenda as always. All of the numbers you post are 10 year averages, not 7 like the present. repost this in 2-3 years, depending on when you start and ended your decades.
Tommy West is 9th in coaching winning percentage at Memphis.
How exactly are actual wins and losses skewed and invalid?
1) You gave 10 year samplings, and the 2000's are not done yet.
2) The 2000's started the first day of 2001, just like that is when the new century started.
I like the way you used 2000 as the starting point, sneaking in Rips last year and trying to make it appear as part of Tommy's record. 2001 was Tommy's 1st year, and he is 41-44.
Tommy still has a losing record, and is ninth in career coaching winning percentage. And I didn't sneak the numbers in. They were copied from the University of Memphis Football Media Guide.
Is this thread about Tommy's record, or wins and losses by decade? If it's Tommy's record, then you should post coach-by-coach records, not by decade and try to make it look like all Tommy.
Your agenda is beginning to flare up again. You can drop it now with one public warning, or end up back where you were. You're choice.
the other Greg Childers Wrote:For those who believe that these are the glory days of Tiger football, here is a brief history lesson.
Record by decade:
1910s 19-25-2 (43.5%)
1920s 35-43-11 (48.5%)
1930s 39-45-7 (48.6%)
1940s 34-23-1 (58.9%)
1950s 48-44-4 (52.1%)
1960s 70-25-1 (73.8%)
1970s 60-48-1 (55.8%)
1980s 31-74-5 (31.2%)
1990s 45-64-1 (41.5%)
2000s 45-51 (46.9%)
It's not even close.
Everyone agrees that the administration needs to make greater commitments to improving the football facilities (including building an on campus stadium). However, we are getting beat by Sun Belt teams with worse facilities than we have so part of the blame has to rest on Tommy's shoulders.
I am not saying that TW is the greatest coach in Tiger History by any means. All I'm saying is that everyone bashing him really needs to look at the numbers.
TW's winning percentage is actually .482 which is only slightly worse than our winning percentages in the 40's, 50's, and 70's. We all know that we at a far greater disadvantage now than we were in the 40's,50's, 60's, and 70's so the fact that we are where we are right now is remarkable. We have done more with less. Now its time for us to do more with more and give TW the support he needs and see what he can do.
It is sad that a losing record is acceptable for us but given the state of our program and our history, it could be ALOT WORSE. Throwing TW under the bus is only going to make it worse. A new coach at this point would simply mean a few more 3-9 and 2-10 seasons while he rebuilds and then wins a few games, gets thrown under the bus and the whole process starts over.
Dak10 Wrote:I know he is a liberal, but has it ever occurred to you that toGC is making sense on this issue? He provides stats while everyone else can only provide personal opinion. Hard for you guys to win in an argument like that.
You say we shouldn't compare it by decades because this one isn't over yet and TW hasn't been here for a full decade. Things aren't getting much better for him though. I really hope this isn't the case, but his winning percentage is probably not going to be getting any better over the next couple of years....
So you rebuke our opinions with more of your opinions. Nice way to talk in circle.
Even looking at the numbers you can see that TW is at the worst an average coach(historically speaking) and realisticly probably slightly above average. I want more than just average for our program but I just dont know that firing TW is the answer. I think giving him more resources is the way to go. If he remains average after giving him all that he needs then its time to make a decision on whether or not to let him go.
kpigout Wrote:Is this thread about Tommy's record, or wins and losses by decade? If it's Tommy's record, then you should post coach-by-coach records, not by decade and try to make it look like all Tommy.
Your agenda is beginning to flare up again. You can drop it now with one public warning, or end up back where you were. You're choice.
As per your request.
Coach by coach records:
13-6 2 seasons (68.4%) Allyn McKeen
91-44-1 14 seasons (67.2%) Billy J. Murphy
11-5-3 2 seasons (65.8%) Lester Barnhard
20-12-1 3 seasons (62.1%) Fred Pancoast
59-43-5 11 seasons (57.4%) Ralph Hatley
6-6 2 seasons (50.0%) V.M. "Bic" Campbell
32-34 6 seasons (48.5%) Richard Williamson
14-15 3 seasons (48.2%) C.C. Humphreys
41-44 7 seasons (48.2%) Tommy West
I respect your opinion but basically completely disagree. We play 2 SUNBELT teams and last year we lost to both. I really think TW makes the easiest schedule possible to get us into one of the 500 bowl games. Dude as of right now we lost to the JOKE of the SEC we are not in the glory days.
Well we have tried the schedule 3 SEC teams a year and go 6-5 and 5-6 and get nowhere and look what it did for us. NOTHING.
If Stobart had only scheduled 1 big out of conference game a year instead of 3 or 4 a year we would have likely had a few 8 or 9 win seasons(and possibly bowl games, maybe even the Liberty Bowl at the time) in the early 90's. But because folks like ya'll whined about wanting to load up on a tough schedule so we can appease all the SEC fanatics in Memphis, we ended up finishing 6-5 three years in a row and firing a good coach because of it.
the other Greg Childers Wrote:kpigout Wrote:Is this thread about Tommy's record, or wins and losses by decade? If it's Tommy's record, then you should post coach-by-coach records, not by decade and try to make it look like all Tommy.
Your agenda is beginning to flare up again. You can drop it now with one public warning, or end up back where you were. You're choice.
As per your request.
Coach by coach records:
13-6 2 seasons (68.4%) Allyn McKeen
91-44-1 14 seasons (67.2%) Billy J. Murphy
11-5-3 2 seasons (65.8%) Lester Barnhard
20-12-1 3 seasons (62.1%) Fred Pancoast
59-43-5 11 seasons (57.4%) Ralph Hatley
6-6 2 seasons (50.0%) V.M. "Bic" Campbell
32-34 6 seasons (48.5%) Richard Williamson
14-15 3 seasons (48.2%) C.C. Humphreys
41-44 7 seasons (48.2%) Tommy West
Where is Rip? (Career: 22-44)
Where is Dempsey? (Career: 7-12-3)
Where is Stobart? (Career: 29-36-1)
Where is Bailey? (Career: 12-20-1)
Where is Dockery? (Career: 8-24-1)
Those are the last 5 coaches before Tommy. Nice how you skipped over that 20 year period.
Agenda.
kpigout Wrote:the other Greg Childers Wrote:kpigout Wrote:Is this thread about Tommy's record, or wins and losses by decade? If it's Tommy's record, then you should post coach-by-coach records, not by decade and try to make it look like all Tommy.
Your agenda is beginning to flare up again. You can drop it now with one public warning, or end up back where you were. You're choice.
As per your request.
Coach by coach records:
13-6 2 seasons (68.4%) Allyn McKeen
91-44-1 14 seasons (67.2%) Billy J. Murphy
11-5-3 2 seasons (65.8%) Lester Barnhard
20-12-1 3 seasons (62.1%) Fred Pancoast
59-43-5 11 seasons (57.4%) Ralph Hatley
6-6 2 seasons (50.0%) V.M. "Bic" Campbell
32-34 6 seasons (48.5%) Richard Williamson
14-15 3 seasons (48.2%) C.C. Humphreys
41-44 7 seasons (48.2%) Tommy West
Where is Rip? (Career: 22-44)
Where is Dempsey? (Career: 7-12-3)
Where is Stobart? (Career: 29-36-1)
Where is Bailey? (Career: 12-20-1)
Where is Dockery? (Career: 8-24-1)
Those are the last 5 coaches before Tommy. Nice how you skipped over that 20 year period.
Agenda.
He's better than the last five. No argument there.
The last five had terrible records. No doubt. He's better than the last five, but considering their records that's not saying much.
Why do you want to compare him to the worst years in Tiger football?
Isn't that self-defeating?
Why not compare him to the best?
The only agenda I have is being the best. Being better than lousy doesn't quite cut it.
the other Greg Childers Wrote:Why do you want to compare him to the worst years in Tiger football?
Isn't that self-defeating?
Why not compare him to the best?
The only agenda I have is being the best. Being better than lousy doesn't quite cut it.
You are comparing him to the best to make him look as bad as possible.
I'm just using the other side of the coin.
the other Greg Childers Wrote:kpigout Wrote:the other Greg Childers Wrote:kpigout Wrote:Is this thread about Tommy's record, or wins and losses by decade? If it's Tommy's record, then you should post coach-by-coach records, not by decade and try to make it look like all Tommy.
Your agenda is beginning to flare up again. You can drop it now with one public warning, or end up back where you were. You're choice.
As per your request.
Coach by coach records:
13-6 2 seasons (68.4%) Allyn McKeen
91-44-1 14 seasons (67.2%) Billy J. Murphy
11-5-3 2 seasons (65.8%) Lester Barnhard
20-12-1 3 seasons (62.1%) Fred Pancoast
59-43-5 11 seasons (57.4%) Ralph Hatley
6-6 2 seasons (50.0%) V.M. "Bic" Campbell
32-34 6 seasons (48.5%) Richard Williamson
14-15 3 seasons (48.2%) C.C. Humphreys
41-44 7 seasons (48.2%) Tommy West
Where is Rip? (Career: 22-44)
Where is Dempsey? (Career: 7-12-3)
Where is Stobart? (Career: 29-36-1)
Where is Bailey? (Career: 12-20-1)
Where is Dockery? (Career: 8-24-1)
Those are the last 5 coaches before Tommy. Nice how you skipped over that 20 year period.
Agenda.
He's better than the last five. No argument there.
The last five had terrible records. No doubt. He's better than the last five, but considering their records that's not saying much.
Why do you want to compare him to the worst years in Tiger football?
Isn't that self-defeating?
Why not compare him to the best?
The only agenda I have is being the best. Being better than lousy doesn't quite cut it.
I predict he will vault to the 6th spot on that list either at the conclusion of this comming year or come within 1 game of it. Would you be "off his back" if that comes to pass?
It's easy to see basketball season has ended.
The football bashers are popping out again.
Geosnooker, togc nor the other haters will NOT get off West's back.
NEVER.
They will be out in force whenever the first loss happens. Mississippi. Louisville. East Carolina. Liberty Bowl. Whoever. It won't matter.
Surely Rains would be proud of these "fans". Their agenda mirrors her goal.
In his eighth year, he should be able to win a division title.
Or am I being unrealistic?
Hater? I love the football program more than a lot of you, apparently.
The football "elitists" are the joke around here. Hold someone accountable. If Tommy lays another egg this year he ought to be drug through the mud. Some of you guys would be thrilled because you would have the Liberty Bowl all to yourself. Then you could claim how great a supporter you are watching 4-8 football teams.
F that. Yeah there is no money for the program, so f-ing what. Go out and win some games then hold Surely's balls to the fire. It happens one of two ways. You get money for the program and then win, or win and then get the money. We aren't doing either. The only way we are going to get some funding is winning. THAT'S TOMMYS FAULT!
You elistists need to get a grip on the sad state of our football program.
togc,
I see what you meant, starting with the coach who had the best % and then going in descending order until you got to West. In my opinion, you should probably omit the guys with 2 or 3 seasons. Also, Stobart's first year, he started in June I think after Bailey got fired, so we should take out his 2-9 first year. That would leave:
91-44-1 14 seasons (67.2%) Billy J. Murphy
59-43-5 11 seasons (57.4%) Ralph Hatley
27-27-1 5 seasons* (50%) Chuck Stobart
32-34 6 seasons (48.5%) Richard Williamson
41-44 7 seasons (48.2%) Tommy West
and Tommy's record includes his heart surgery year with the distractions it caused.
boss man Wrote:It's easy to see basketball season has ended.
The football bashers are popping out again.
Geosnooker, togc nor the other haters will NOT get off West's back.
NEVER.
They will be out in force whenever the first loss happens. Mississippi. Louisville. East Carolina. Liberty Bowl. Whoever. It won't matter.
Surely Rains would be proud of these "fans". Their agenda mirrors her goal.
WTF!?!?
I'm not a hater of Tommy west! Look at the main board at the thread I started and read my original post. I said Tommy's the man for the job. Please don't lump me in with "Tommy's gotta go" crowd Boss man?!
Hell, LOOK AT MY POST RIGHT ABOVE YOURS! I JUST PREDICTED HE WOULD GO 8-4!!!
EDIT! I now understand how things can so easily be misread using this medium. Boss man was telling me, not including me with togc, as indicated by the comma after my name. I appologize for over reacting.
Herff Tiger Wrote:togc,
I see what you meant, starting with the coach who had the best % and then going in descending order until you got to West. In my opinion, you should probably omit the guys with 2 or 3 seasons. Also, Stobart's first year, he started in June I think after Bailey got fired, so we should take out his 2-9 first year. That would leave:
91-44-1 14 seasons (67.2%) Billy J. Murphy
59-43-5 11 seasons (57.4%) Ralph Hatley
27-27-1 5 seasons* (50%) Chuck Stobart
32-34 6 seasons (48.5%) Richard Williamson
41-44 7 seasons (48.2%) Tommy West
and Tommy's record includes his heart surgery year with the distractions it caused.
You can't take out any of the seasons in those records. They happened, and you have to count them.
i think it's funny that everyone's so touchy when it comes to talking about TW and the football program, but a thread can be started about how bad the baseball team is, and no one gets jumped on.
lighten up, folks.
boss man Wrote:It's easy to see basketball season has ended.
The football bashers are popping out again.
Geosnooker, togc nor the other haters will NOT get off West's back.
NEVER.
They will be out in force whenever the first loss happens. Mississippi. Louisville. East Carolina. Liberty Bowl. Whoever. It won't matter.
Surely Rains would be proud of these "fans". Their agenda mirrors her goal.
We are not football bashers. We want more out of the program than the crappy football we have witnessed the last two years.
You ****** just like crappy football.
pkptigers07 Wrote:I think giving him more resources is the way to go. If he remains average after giving him all that he needs then its time to make a decision on whether or not to let him go.
How did he do at Clemson when he had all of the resources he needed? He is a good man and an o.k. coach. If we want to settle for mediocrity he is the man to keep. It seems 75% of the people want to settle on this board, so why don't we just sign him to a 10 year extension.
I love tying for 2nd in my division and going to the New Orleans Bowl!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :)
Until TW wins a C-USA Championship he hasn't done his job and I will not get off of his back until he does his job. He has done nothing in his 8 years to prove he can do it. He had Gostowski and DeAngelo and he couldn't do it, how will he get it done now? With the hirings of Fedora and Jones things definitely aren't getting easier for him. We are slowly being passed over by everyone in our conference and everyone in conferences below us.
I fear the day we lose to a Division II team in our squash game isn't very far away....
the other Greg Childers Wrote:However, we are getting beat by Sun Belt teams with worse facilities than we have so part of the blame has to rest on Tommy's shoulders.
hmmmmmm, lets see about that.
Arkey State:
OCS updated in 1991 and again in 2002- 30,000 capacity "In 2002, more changes came to the stadium. The players and coaches of the school moved into a brand new complex that included office space for coaches, dressing rooms, meeting rooms, and player lounges..."
MTSU
FloydStadium OCS 31,000...
"A technologically-advanced athletic academic enhancement center, for all Blue Raider and Lady Raider athletes, is located in the southwest corner of the stadium. Aside from counselors and tutors, the facility also houses a multitude of computers for use by all athletes.
Also located inside the north end of the stadium is a new weight training facility, which is used by all Blue Raiders athletes. The weight training area rivals that of any school in the south, even including Southeastern Conference schools."
http://www.goblueraiders.com/content.cfm/id/163
FIU
The Cage
"As a result of construction begun March 2007, the FIU Stadium is undergoing an expansion for the 2008 football season. Upon completion, seating capacity is increased to 23,500, including 1,400 club seats. In addition, the stadium will have a 6,500 square-foot Panther Club, an upper concourse, a new press box, new lighting, a jumbotron scoreboard, new coaches' offices, locker rooms, expansion of the weight room, and 19 suites. Seating will include chairback seats and bench seating, all with backrests for fan convenience. Additional phases of construction will include a student support complex and will bring the stadium’s seating capacity to approximately 45,000 by the 2010 football season."
FAU in Boca Raton, if that's not enough...OCS
"Due to open in 2010, the stadium is the final phase of the university's Innovation Village, a multi-purpose project which will include five additional apartment-style residence halls, 130,000 square feet (12,000 m²) of retail shopping space and a multi-use Convocation Center for the basketball program.[1][1]
While initial plans suggested a 40,000 seat dome stadium, the newly-approved plans call for a smaller, 30,000 seat capacity venue that would be open-air. The steel stadium, modeled after the University of Central Florida's new Bright House Networks Stadium, would allow for future seating expansion as well as a roof if needed. Cost of the project has been estimated at $62 million and will be funded through private donations; no public funds (including tax revenues) are expected to finance the stadium"
Troy which has only been in D1 since 2001..
Unlike many teams in college football, the Troy Trojans home is one of the few stadium in which the naming rights have been sold. Located in Troy, AL, Movie Gallery Stadium, has been the home of the football program for many years. The latest project to be completed at Movie Gallery Stadium was a $18 million expansion to increase the seating capacity from 12,000 to 30,000 in part to meet Division 1-A standards in 2003. The latest artificial turf, Astroplay was installed along with the construction of a new pressbox and 27 luxury suites.
..
yea I see your point- I can't believe TW isn't winning every recruiting battle he's in- our recruiting budget coupled with our new state of the art facilities- hell, we should be NCs in a couple years- and if were not, fire TW it's got to be his fault.
Some of you people absolutely have no clue on how the real world operates-
callemasIsee-em Wrote:the other Greg Childers Wrote:However, we are getting beat by Sun Belt teams with worse facilities than we have so part of the blame has to rest on Tommy's shoulders.
hmmmmmm, lets see about that.
Arkey State:
OCS updated in 1991 and again in 2002- 30,000 capacity "In 2002, more changes came to the stadium. The players and coaches of the school moved into a brand new complex that included office space for coaches, dressing rooms, meeting rooms, and player lounges..."
MTSU
FloydStadium OCS 31,000...
"A technologically-advanced athletic academic enhancement center, for all Blue Raider and Lady Raider athletes, is located in the southwest corner of the stadium. Aside from counselors and tutors, the facility also houses a multitude of computers for use by all athletes.
Also located inside the north end of the stadium is a new weight training facility, which is used by all Blue Raiders athletes. The weight training area rivals that of any school in the south, even including Southeastern Conference schools."
http://www.goblueraiders.com/content.cfm/id/163
Having seen pretty much everything but the MTSU weight training facility, I'd wager that there are high schools in Texas with facilities just as good.
Dak10 Wrote:Having seen pretty much everything but the MTSU weight training facility, I'd wager that there are high schools in Texas with facilities just as good.
that's BS. I'll take that bet-
Dak10 Wrote:callemasIsee-em Wrote:the other Greg Childers Wrote:However, we are getting beat by Sun Belt teams with worse facilities than we have so part of the blame has to rest on Tommy's shoulders.
hmmmmmm, lets see about that.
Arkey State:
OCS updated in 1991 and again in 2002- 30,000 capacity "In 2002, more changes came to the stadium. The players and coaches of the school moved into a brand new complex that included office space for coaches, dressing rooms, meeting rooms, and player lounges..."
MTSU
FloydStadium OCS 31,000...
"A technologically-advanced athletic academic enhancement center, for all Blue Raider and Lady Raider athletes, is located in the southwest corner of the stadium. Aside from counselors and tutors, the facility also houses a multitude of computers for use by all athletes.
Also located inside the north end of the stadium is a new weight training facility, which is used by all Blue Raiders athletes. The weight training area rivals that of any school in the south, even including Southeastern Conference schools."
http://www.goblueraiders.com/content.cfm/id/163
Having seen pretty much everything but the MTSU weight training facility, I'd wager that there are high schools in Texas with facilities just as good.
Facilities aren't as important as the coaching staff itself.
While coach at Cincinnati, Bob Huggins' Bearcats played in the Shoemaker Center, which is nothing more than an oversized 1950s high school gym but that didn't stop them from kicking everyone in C-USA's butt.
the other Greg Childers Wrote:Facilities aren't as important as the coaching staff itself.
While coach at Cincinnati, Bob Huggins' Bearcats played in the Shoemaker Center, which is nothing more than an oversized 1950s high school gym but that didn't stop them from kicking everyone in C-USA's butt.
oh I thought you said we were getting beat by SB teams with worse facilities than us.. now there not important...ok
let's try this: you should get up go outside and take a look around.. the real world operates on money- money buys you nice things like new facilities OCS and locker rooms. Which in turn, gets you nice recruits which help you win conference championships-
"Facilities aren't as important as the coaching staff itself." Really? I'd be willing to bet that if greatest coach ever was standing in the middle of Podunk,MS with nothing but a smile on his face and a bag of shite(old facilities)... that 5* recruit would say man he's the greatest coach ever, but all he has is shite-and head on down the road-
and who gives a F about hudgins? were talking TW and Memphis football.
Calipari won a lot of games at UMass with crap facilities, and without a lot of highly recruited players.
And for the record, my statement about SB teams having worse facilities and still beating us kinda proves that coaching matters more than facilities.
the other Greg Childers Wrote:Calipari won a lot of games at UMass with crap facilities, and without a lot of highly recruited players.
And for the record, my statement about SB teams having worse facilities and still beating us kinda proves that coaching matters more than facilities.
do you always talk in circles? your statement is incorrect- WE are the ones lacking in facilities.. first we were getting beat by SB teams with worse facilities, then facilities didn't matter.. now where back to your original statement that wasn't true... so you really haven't proved anything- only wasted my time with this retort-
I can't stand people who get on b#itch and moan repeatedly about issues and never offer solutions. I have complained about things in the past, AND I offer solutions to fix the "problems"
In 2000, Who are we supposed to get as a coach?
Tommy was probably the best chance for a coach with some experience and success at a BCS school.
In 2008, Who are we supposed to get if we fired Tommy. No one is going to come to Memphis coach that is any "better" than Tommy West if we fire a coach after going to 4 bowls in 5 years. We aren't Alabama, Tennessee, or USC. It isn't the "dream" of every coach in America to come coach at Memphis in the shadow of John Calipari.
Think about it, Unless we can pony up another million in head coach salary I doubt we can come up with someone who's better who is willing to work for us. I do thing improvements can be made, but TW only has SO much power.
If yall are so mad about things you should come with a better idea for RC and Dr. Raines
callemasIsee-em Wrote:the other Greg Childers Wrote:Calipari won a lot of games at UMass with crap facilities, and without a lot of highly recruited players.
And for the record, my statement about SB teams having worse facilities and still beating us kinda proves that coaching matters more than facilities.
do you always talk in circles? your statement is incorrect- WE are the ones lacking in facilities.. first we were getting beat by SB teams with worse facilities, then facilities didn't matter.. now where back to your original statement that wasn't true... so you really haven't proved anything- only wasted my time with this retort-
You aren't paying attention.
If better facilities matter, why are we getting beat by teams with worse facilities?
supertiger Wrote:Tommy was probably the best chance for a coach with some experience and success at a BCS school.
Tommy had so much success he was fired at Clemson.
Let's look at his record compared to the three coaches before him and the one after him.
Charlie Pell
1977-78 (2 seasons)
18-4-1 (80.4%)
Danny Ford
1978-89 (12 seasons)
96-29-4 (76.0%)
Ken Hatfield
1990-93 (4 seasons)
32-13-1 (70.7%)
Tommy West
1993-98 (6 seasons)
31-28 (52.5%)
Tommy Bowden
1999-2007 (9 seasons)
69-42 (62.1%)
supertiger Wrote:I can't stand people who get on b#itch and moan repeatedly about issues and never offer solutions. I have complained about things in the past, AND I offer solutions to fix the "problems"
In 2000, Who are we supposed to get as a coach?
Tommy was probably the best chance for a coach with some experience and success at a BCS school.
In 2008, Who are we supposed to get if we fired Tommy. No one is going to come to Memphis coach that is any "better" than Tommy West if we fire a coach after going to 4 bowls in 5 years. We aren't Alabama, Tennessee, or USC. It isn't the "dream" of every coach in America to come coach at Memphis in the shadow of John Calipari.
Think about it, Unless we can pony up another million in head coach salary I doubt we can come up with someone who's better who is willing to work for us. I do thing improvements can be made, but TW only has SO much power.
If yall are so mad about things you should come with a better idea for RC and Dr. Raines
Offering solutions to fix a problem on a message board does as much good as complaining.
Why do we have to get a coach with experience? I would rather have someone getting their first chance at a coaching job as our head guy than someone who has the experience TW has. TW's experience was barely being .500 at Clemson, a BCS school. He was fired.
I'm sure that if you were to look at the stats it would show that coaches who are hired for their first head coaching job have about as much success, if not more than, as an experienced coach who was fired for bad performance at his previous job.
That is saying a lot when you consider how many coordinators (like Orgeron for instance) are hired from a big school and then fired after a couple of seasons. Heck, Orgeron was even able to beat TW. Pathetic....
Dude, if we fired TW we wouldn't have to go after Bear Bryant. Look at Southern Miss as just one example out of hundreds. They hired an assistant and gave him his first shot. In recruiting they went from a program of mediocrity to a successful one in a few weeks of him being over the job. If he is able to translate that to success on the field then it would prove that past experience means nothing. If he can't, it still shows that past experience means pretty much nothing.
Coaches wouldn't mind being in Cal's shadow. Many would probably enjoy that. However, a good coach would be able to share the shadow. Memphis fans aren't asking for BCS bowls, they are asking for conference championships and Liberty Bowl appearances and occasionally Liberty Bowl wins.
Pony up another million? If we started paying a coach 2 million right off then he better be someone with a track record of major success. Half the coaches that beat TW make less than he does. That comment was ridiculous.
You are right. TW only has so much power. The power to win some games against the cupcake teams that have been beating us the last couple of years for instance.
Once again, while toGC supplies facts and numbers, you guys give opinions and ask questions.
the other Greg Childers Wrote:callemasIsee-em Wrote:the other Greg Childers Wrote:Calipari won a lot of games at UMass with crap facilities, and without a lot of highly recruited players.
And for the record, my statement about SB teams having worse facilities and still beating us kinda proves that coaching matters more than facilities.
do you always talk in circles? your statement is incorrect- WE are the ones lacking in facilities.. first we were getting beat by SB teams with worse facilities, then facilities didn't matter.. now where back to your original statement that wasn't true... so you really haven't proved anything- only wasted my time with this retort-
You aren't paying attention.
If better facilities matter, why are we getting beat by teams with worse facilities?
we'll try it this way-then name one team who beat us last year that has worse facilities than us-
callemasIsee-em Wrote:we'll try it this way-then name one team who beat us last year that has worse facilities than us-
Doesn't matter to him. He just likes the attention.
WE CAN'T AFFORD TO FIRE TOMMY WEST....
If we fired TW after 2006 we would have to pony up at least $4,000,000 for a contract buy-out, pay a head-hunter, a sign-on bonus for a new coach, and pay a salary increase.
I'm sure the University of Memphis has $6,000,000 to plunk down simply because our coach can't quite make the leap from lower-tier to slightly-less mediocre bowls. Right now we can't do much until after 2009. Now, If you are willing to pony up your $6,000,000 then I think RC will more than glad to can Tommy West. Of course, by now I think $4,000,000 will probably cover the entire thing. I'm sure you have your pen and checkbook ready.
Yes, it makes me mad to lose to teams with coaches that get paid a third of what ours does. At this point, Memphis could hire Nick Saban or Bear Bryant and still not have the #1 recruiting class or go to a national championship. Even the best recruiter in the world can't compete while they have a circus tent with pizza compared to a multi-million recruiting center with an all-you-can-eat buffet. We have a clean program that has a hard time competing against brown paper bags full of hundreds from SEC boosters. Who do we hire for $1,000,000 that's better than Tommy West. You can't just say- "well, such and such works for $800,000 at such and such" It doesn't work that way. It is exceptionally difficult to get quality coaching talent that is affordable and stable. I don't want to dump millions of dollars and YES it will be millions of dollars into a new coach that will be here two years before he leaves for another school. The simple truth is that a new head coach is not going to be some panacea that will win us a national championship within a year.
We have a hard time getting good assistant coaches. We pay alot less than other programs that compete in even non-BCS schools. We don't really have a go-to guy for recruiting that can seal the deal like Derek Kellog was for Calipari. We need to increase every assistant's salary by $100,000 if we want meaningful increases in quality. Some of you stress the importance of getting someone young who has no experience. This may sound really good and cheaper, but what if we dump millions into a guy that only wins 4 games in 2 years? Then what. We would be in worse shape financially and program-wise.
Do I think we need a new coach in 2009, probably yes, but it serves no purpose to get on here every single day and bash Tommy West. It can't really be said that Memphis is a football powerhouse brought down by the willy nilly management by Tommy West.
Let me ask you this, Since Alabama lost to Louisiana-Whoever in 2007 does that mean that Nick Saban is a bad coach. When Lloyd Carr's Wolverines lost to Appalachian State did that mean that he is a bad coach? Let's see how your circular logic operates.
supertiger Wrote:Let me ask you this, Since Alabama lost to Louisiana-Whoever in 2007 does that mean that Nick Saban is a bad coach. When Lloyd Carr's Wolverines lost to Appalachian State did that mean that he is a bad coach? Let's see how your circular logic operates.
Nick Saban and Lloyd Carr haven't lost four consecutive games to Sun Belt teams.
Since it would be way too expensive to let Tommy West go, I ask this question.
Why hasn't Tommy publicly addressed the issue of facilities? Why isn't he at the front of the on campus stadium movement? Why hasn't he called RC Johnson to the carpet for promises made but still unfulfilled? I mean, if he's too expensive to replace, then he should be able to say whatever he wants without impunity.
When Calipari wants something, he goes out and gets it. Tommy does not. I know it shouldn't be part of the job, but it is what it is.
Also, if Tommy is such a brilliant head coach, why has no one tried to swoop in and take him from us? I mean, there are a lot of programs that can pay him and his assistants more, that have better facilities, and have better fan support. Why hasn't he been flooded with other offers?
the other Greg Childers Wrote:Since it would be way too expensive to let Tommy West go, I ask this question.
Why hasn't Tommy publicly addressed the issue of facilities? Why isn't he at the front of the on campus stadium movement? Why hasn't he called RC Johnson to the carpet for promises made but still unfulfilled? I mean, if he's too expensive to replace, then he should be able to say whatever he wants without impunity.
When Calipari wants something, he goes out and gets it. Tommy does not. I know it shouldn't be part of the job, but it is what it is.
Also, if Tommy is such a brilliant head coach, why has no one tried to swoop in and take him from us? I mean, there are a lot of programs that can pay him and his assistants more, that have better facilities, and have better fan support. Why hasn't he been flooded with other offers?
You took the words right out of my mouth.
Dak10 Wrote:the other Greg Childers Wrote:Since it would be way too expensive to let Tommy West go, I ask this question.
Why hasn't Tommy publicly addressed the issue of facilities? Why isn't he at the front of the on campus stadium movement? Why hasn't he called RC Johnson to the carpet for promises made but still unfulfilled? I mean, if he's too expensive to replace, then he should be able to say whatever he wants without impunity.
When Calipari wants something, he goes out and gets it. Tommy does not. I know it shouldn't be part of the job, but it is what it is.
Also, if Tommy is such a brilliant head coach, why has no one tried to swoop in and take him from us? I mean, there are a lot of programs that can pay him and his assistants more, that have better facilities, and have better fan support. Why hasn't he been flooded with other offers?
You took the words right out of my mouth.
Apples do not equal oranges
supertiger Wrote:Dak10 Wrote:the other Greg Childers Wrote:Since it would be way too expensive to let Tommy West go, I ask this question.
Why hasn't Tommy publicly addressed the issue of facilities? Why isn't he at the front of the on campus stadium movement? Why hasn't he called RC Johnson to the carpet for promises made but still unfulfilled? I mean, if he's too expensive to replace, then he should be able to say whatever he wants without impunity.
When Calipari wants something, he goes out and gets it. Tommy does not. I know it shouldn't be part of the job, but it is what it is.
Also, if Tommy is such a brilliant head coach, why has no one tried to swoop in and take him from us? I mean, there are a lot of programs that can pay him and his assistants more, that have better facilities, and have better fan support. Why hasn't he been flooded with other offers?
You took the words right out of my mouth.
Apples do not equal oranges
That's it?
geosnooker2000 Wrote:boss man Wrote:It's easy to see basketball season has ended.
The football bashers are popping out again.
Geosnooker, togc nor the other haters will NOT get off West's back.
NEVER.
They will be out in force whenever the first loss happens. Mississippi. Louisville. East Carolina. Liberty Bowl. Whoever. It won't matter.
Surely Rains would be proud of these "fans". Their agenda mirrors her goal.
WTF!?!?
I'm not a hater of Tommy west! Look at the main board at the thread I started and read my original post. I said Tommy's the man for the job. Please don't lump me in with "Tommy's gotta go" crowd Boss man?!
Hell, LOOK AT MY POST RIGHT ABOVE YOURS! I JUST PREDICTED HE WOULD GO 8-4!!!
Geosnooker -
Damn. Yeah, that looks bad now that I re-read it. Sorry.
I was ADDRESSING you due to your post.
I was saying to YOU that togc and other haters like Dak10, Captain T, etc. will
NOT get off West's back.
I should have said it a different way. Probably should have put your original response inquotes and more definitively addressed you. My bad.
TO MAKE IT CLEAR -
Geosnooker = TIGER fan in all sports, including football.
togc, dak10, Buffalo T = frontrunning TIGER basketball fans that enjoy taking shots against the football program and "elitist fans".
boss man Wrote:togc, dak10, Buffalo T = frontrunning TIGER basketball fans that enjoy taking shots against the football program and "elitist fans".
boss man = knee jerk reactionary who doesn't both to actually read posts