NCAAbbs

...the can of worms is now open! And, it's a big one!

http://www.anygivensaturday.com/forum/sh...hp?t=36130

A few OVC tidbits:

The OVC will be reduced to 10 members after Samford moves to the SoCon next year. The remaining schools are all public. The conference office is in Nashville. ETSU was in the OVC years ago. Jax State might be exploring a move to FBS.

As a Murray St. fan, I'd like for the OVC to look at Belmont, Lipscomb and ETSU.
Also, SIU-Edwardsville, Northern Kentucky, Evansville, and North Alabama have been discussed.

The OVC did this with schools in mind, they wouldn't have done it, just to do it.

I feel this is a mistake on the part of the OVC. Conference members should be as similar as possible whenever possible. Adding non-football schools could start to seriously erode their brand identity. I agree that the OVC obviously has some non-football schools in mind, hence the rule change, but I am not sure this is the best path for them to pursue. Only time will bear the situation out for sure, though, and it is always possible that I could be proven wrong on this matter. We will see.

Morehead State plays Pioneer League football, so perhaps they were the school in mind? Obviously this helps Jacksonville State if they drink the FBS Kool Aid and can't find a primary home (MAC football #14?).

I don't think Belmont or Lipscomb would be a wise add to the conference unless if Tennessee State also leaves the conference, because the OVC already has a presence in Nashville.

The football requirement out of the way is a major gift to SIU-Edwardsville; the only question is can they bring along Western Illinois (who would have to move football too since the OVC sponsors it). Likewise, it is also a gift to Northern Kentucky who may again decide to study Division I membership. Bellarmine hasn't officially made any noise about going Division I, but would probably be the only private school the OVC seriously considered.

Chicago State wouldn't be my first choice, but is a viable option. The OVC would add a school with a similar profile to TSU, and one that isn't that far removed from the rest of the conference. Chicago State would be a little more palatable if the OVC were to add another school in Illinois:

North - Chicago State, SIU-E/WIU, Southeast Missouri State, Eastern Kentucky, Morehead State, Eastern Illinois
South - Murray State, Austin Peay, Tennessee State, Tennessee Tech, Chattanooga, Jacksonville State

Chicago State also adds exposure (albeit not that much) in basketball-rich Chicago. Having the OVC tournament in Chicago could do a lot for basketball recruiting.

Centenary is just too far from the rest of the conference. If the OVC somehow winds up with UALR, then Centenary might be an option, but UALR to the Summit would be more likely (i.e., Sun Belt requires FBS football). Central Arkansas would be a better pick for the OVC, but UCA just joined the Southland.

ETSU is probably the next school in the conference.

Here's what I think the OVC has in mind. The OVC currently has 11 members. Until now, they said that they were not going to add any schools when Samford departed. But with Samford leaving, there goes JSU's travel partner. Also, JSU is thinking about going to FBS football (Don't know why except for money). That leaves us 9 members.

Right now we have a 20 game conference schedule, which KILLS rpi. I believe that the OVC should add 2 members when Samford leaves and then replace JSU when they leaves.

BTW Charger, Chattanooga has already turned us down recently and you forgot Martin.

I'd say this:

North- Murray State, Eastern KY, Eastern Ill, Morehead St., SEMO, UT Martin
South-Tennessee Tech, Austin Peay, Tennessee St, Belmont, Lipscomb, ETSU

That made me laugh. Why else would they go? If it's not direct money from the program it's the money from the exposure.

Yes but when you don't win, your attendance isn't very good.
To be FBS, you have to mantain certain attendance standards and I don't see them keeping up with that.

It could be argued that playing higher caliber teams known nationwide would bring more attendance and more pride from alumni. I agree, if you don't win, it's difficult.

Jax State is probably chasing Troy in their FBS dreams. They seem FCS to me, though.

Assuming this decision by the OVC is geared toward expansion (and not internal issues w/ JSU, Morehead, and Tenn State), I can definitely see the A-Sun's Tennessee schools moving over. We'll have to wait and see how many and which ones. I read that JSU's feasibility study findings will be released next week and that might determine numbers.

If only one, I'd say ETSU. It gets interesting if it's two, though....Belmont/Lipscomb? Belmont/ETSU? Three might get complicated by SIU-Edwardsville, North Alabama, and others that could come aboard after the moratorium is lifted.

My main concern is the A-Sun's auto-bid. What exactly is the current NCAA continuity rule....6 schools together for 5 years?

Jacksonville State will be taking a big gamble if the Gamecocks jump to FBS, after the moratorium ends, without a conference affiliation secured. The Sun Belt has pretty much already told them no and they have no shot at Conference USA. Independence in FBS is not a particularly pleasant state of being these days unless your name is Army, Navy, or Notre Dame.

I think it would make a lot more sense for the OVC to grab North Alabama, when the moratorium ends and they are ready to move up, as a partner to Jacksonville State. This returns the league to Alabama and gives the Gamecocks a new local rival. Even better, both are state schools, so they would be able to compete with each other on reasonably equal footing.

Most OVC people are ready to be done with Alabama. If we were to add ETSU, Belmont or Lipscomb, it would return it to mostly KY and TN, with SEMO and EIU being the only exceptions.

I'd rather get a team from MO or IL or IN than from AL.

Would you rather limit the bulk of your conference to just two states? Most leagues seem to be into expanding their footprints in this day and age rather than contracting them. If adding North Alabama would get Jacksonville State to stay then that should be a net plus for the OVC. Then the league could focus on finding one more team in Illinois, Kentucky, or Missouri to round things out at 12 members. At least that has been the conventional way of doing things according to recent trends in the NCAA anyway.

With gas prices, it would greatly benefit the OVC members if JSU left. We tried expanding to Alabama, and so far it has come with no benefit. I'd rather get a Belmont than to keep JSU.

In case you haven't seen the RPI recently, JSU and EIU and the 2 worst teams in the county.

If Lipscomb, Belmont, AND ETSU left the A-Sun... then Mercer might go to the NCAA's every year...

don't forget I think ETSU has a million dollar buyout before 2011 or something. So I doubt they are moving anywhere.

There is a pretty lively discussion of this topic taking place on the Any Given Saturday website, as well, if anyone wants to venture over there to check out the opinions of a few more OVC fans or other FCS fans.

We don't have alot of donors, but I would be willing to bet that ETSU would find a way to get the money to get out if it came right down to it. We're dying for rivalries, teams/schools that ETSU can identify with.

How serious is the talk about Campbell going to the Big South?

Who exactly is dying for those rivalries? Dave Mullins, Paul Stanton??
If they were concerned about rivalries ETSU would not be here to start with. If there are no donors then there is no pressure for them to be concerned either. Many of the schools in this conference have smaller enrollments than ETSU but so did Davidson, and The Citadel as well as other SoCon opponents. Many of the schools in this conference appear to be determined to improve their athletic programs and this conference appears to be merely a stop along the way in their journey. Much could be learned from that philosophy. Rivalries are what you make of them. They are built through intense competition year after year. I am not a great fan of the Atlantic Sun but moving to another marginal conference will not move the athletic department in the direction that it needs to go nor will it automatically create rivalries.
Why can ETSU not identify with a 20,000 student university from one of the largest southeast metropolitan areas with whom we have already had war on the basketball court?

I haven't heard anything about going back to the Big South.

If the OVC wants to add members now then they will probably go with ETSU & Belmont. Then if Jacksonville St. leaves in 2011 the OVC will take UNA to get back to 9 FB members.

1 problem with adding 2 members now is if Jacksonville St. stays that would prevent UNA from getting in.

UNA is a D-II football power every year. UNA is almost at the Tenn border in Florence AL so no real worry of spreading the conference too far.

For a non-football school what would be the attraction in moving to the OVC? Their conference RPI is lower then the A-Sun's.

GaSt.

If two teams with decent RRPs (Belmont and ETSU for example) ASun would not be above OVC in RPI.

Also if two teams from the ASun leave---ASun loses their autobid to the NCAA and NIT tourneys.

I think the thought is not to be caught in a conference without an autobid, and not in one with mostly DII teams moving up.

I guess I can see this. If you add in "Institutional Identity" with peer schools, I guess I can see how this would make sense.

SIU-Edwardsville to join OVC
By Sports Network
The Sports Network

Southern Illinois-Edwardsville will become the newest member of the Ohio Valley Conference.

The move was unanimously approved by the OVC Board of Presidents late last month. The school will join the conference July 1, but will continue its reclassification period from Division II to Division I.

All SIUE team sports will begin regular-season competition in the OVC during the 2011-12 academic year and will be eligible for postseason conference play the following year.

"The addition of SIUE makes us a stronger conference," said OVC commissioner Dr. Jon A. Steinbrecher. "After our evaluation of the university, it was clear that it is a Division I institution, given the scope and breadth of its academic and athletic offerings."

SIUE, founded in 1957, is located in Edwardsville, Illinois, just northeast of St. Louis. It had previously been a member of the Great Lakes Valley Conference, and won the league's All-Sports Trophy in 2006-07.

The Ohio Valley is expanding for the first time since 2003 when it added two institutions, including current member Jacksonville State. Samford also joined the league that year, but is leaving in July to join the Southern Conference.

Other members of the OVC, in addition to Jacksonville State, are Austin Peay, Eastern Illinois, Eastern Kentucky, Morehead State, Murray State, Southeast Missouri State, Tennessee State, Tennessee Tech and Tennessee-Martin.

This article appeared in the San Luis Obispo Tribune on Tuesday, June 10, 2008.

Doesn't exactly do anything for me.

nor me either.

ETSU,
sure ya'll don't want to change your minds?

haha

I had a feeling this was coming. Eastern Illinois finally has a rival and scheduling partner so the Panthers no longer look so out of place in the OVC as they originally did when they joined that league in 1996. This pretty much sets up North Alabama to become the 12th member of the OVC when the moratorium is lifted and they jump up to Division I in a few years. Making that addition might be one of the only moves that can ultimately keep Jacksonville State from - mistakenly in some opinions - trying to go up to the FBS level.

PROJECTED FUTURE OVC NORTH
Eastern Illinois / SIU-Edwardsville (no football)
Southeast Missouri / Murray State
Eastern Kentucky / Morehead State (fooball in PFL)
PROJECTED FUTURE OVC SOUTH
Tennessee-Martin / Austin Peay
Tennessee State / Tennessee Tech
North Alabama / Jacksonville State

By the way, SIU-Edwardsville was a soccer-only member of the Mid-Continent Conference in the '90s, and Jon Steinbrecher was the Commissioner of that league then before eventually going to the OVC. I am pretty sure his old ties to the SIU-Edwardsville administration, as well as the need to finally get a real rival for Eastern Illinois in the OVC, helped make this move possible. Now it is up to the OVC to make the North Alabama thing happen or else it is highly likely that they may lose Jacksonville State as mentioned above.

ahhh yes, we were all worried to death about Eastern Illinois

Are yall trying to become ASUN jr. or what?

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

I really hope Jacksonville State doesn't try to pursue Division 1-A status right now. I can think of a few reasons why it would too risky for them. There probably will not be room in a 1-A conference for their football team for quite a while. As a 1-A independent, their chances of participating in a bowl game would rely on conferences not being able to fill their bowl slots. Filling the schedule as an independent would be extremely difficult, and they possibly would have to play only four or five times at home in some years in order to have a 12-game schedule. No, I believe JSU needs to stay in the OVC for now.

I agree. Hopefully, if the OVC adds North Alabama, that will be enough to satisfy Jacksonville State for a few years. They would be getting a similar state school to start a new rivalry with and they would also save some travel dollars by cutting out a couple of annual trips up to their most distant opponents in basketball and minor sports.

This is a good outcome for SIU-Edwardsville. Now if the Summit League expands, they'll pretty much be forced to look west of the Mississippi River.

If Jacksonville State wouldn't be the smallest public school in FBS, it wouldn't be by much. Pretty much every other school in the OVC would is larger than JSU, and even a couple of the ones that aren't (Austin Peay State and Southeast Missouri State) would probably have better chances at finding homes because of their location and/or native market.

charger,
what are you talking about?

Why would AP and SEMO need to find homes?

I'm not saying they need to, only they'd have an easier time than Jax State if they moved up to FBS.

I think what chargeradio means is that he believes Austin Peay and Southeast Missouri would have an easier time getting into an FBS conference than Jacksonville State would.

Here's what I hope will happen. In 2011, SIU-E moves into OVC play and the league adds ETSU or Belmont. 2012-14 JSU leaves for 1-A and the league adds Northern Kentucky. Ideally, SIU-E wouldn't have been added at all. My hopefull predictions.

OVC North (Projected)
EKU
Morehead State (returns to OVC football in 2012-14)
Murray
EIU
SIU-E
NKU (after JSU leaves)

OVC South
AP
TTU
TSU
SEMO
UT-Martin
ETSU or Belmont

Tournament is held at either A. NKU's marvelous new arena B. At Belmont or C. Rotating basis between winner of North regular season or South regular season. No more Gaylord Entertainment center or Nashville arena.

According to Kenpom.com since '05 the OVC has averaged 24th in RPI where the A-Sun has averaged 26th. If you throw out the outliers - then the OVC has averaged 25th and the A-Sun has averaged 28th.

So with that being said it doesn't seem like moving to the OVC would be a big deal for ETSU/Belmont. It seems like the biggest advantage would be that it allows them to play in a more regional conference and against more Tennessee teams.

I don't know ETSU/Belmont well enough to know how important that is to the them, but as far as league competitiveness is concerned I'm not seeing how the move will make much of a difference.

For ETSU though it may have the added positive affect of giving them a home for their football program whenever they resume it. And for Belmont it would have the added negative affect of separating them from Lipscomb which is a big rivalry (and big draw) for Belmont.

Just my thoughts. What do you guys think ETSU and Belmont fans?

ETSU already turned it down.

Do you think ETSU turned it down b/c it may have led to more people bugging the admin about football? Right now they have it made being in a conference without football, but if the A-Sun added non-scholarship football that might entice people to bug the admin more.

I think adding Belmont, Lipscomb, or ETSU would be good for the OVC. If not, Northern Kentucky would be the best choice. I mean you don't build this and not go D-I. ARENA
Wouldn't Johnson City and ETSU be able to manage a 9,000 seat arena? Not baiting, just asking.

Could be part of the reason. The reason they gave, is that the OVC was a lateral move and why move if your not moving up. Fair enough. And yeah, JC and ETSU could manage a new arena. We just don't have anyone brain running things this side of Boone, NC.

Why not move to save some money on travel? One would think it would cut some costs not having to fly teams to Florida and back, or course during one of the worst financial crises since the Great Depression, our golf team is going to Hawaii.